Pass Mark 2015

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Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #90 – January 13, 2015, 09:57:02 am

Quote from: ItsOurTime on January 13, 2015, 09:17:48 am

Murphy was doing much more blue collar stuff than tearing sides apart. Would love to see him kicking 30 goals again as well as his defensive work.

This^^.

I know I've been his biggest critic but I've also always said he has the ability to be as effective as Gary Ablett if he does all the tough stuff as well, such is his skill with ball in hand. Really turned the corner last year, but possibly to the detriment of his attacking play a little. If he can find the right balance lookout.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #91 – January 13, 2015, 01:32:15 pm

Quote from: Thryleon on January 12, 2015, 09:06:37 pm

I reckon the number of A graders in your team changes the higher up the ladder you finish.

Pretty much, rarely do defenders in bottom teams get rated because of the results.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #92 – January 13, 2015, 02:21:42 pm

Big test for Murphy and Gibbs when Judd retires and they dont have the big body in the packs to help them out and take the best taggers each week...Malthouse needs to blood Cripps this season to take over from Judd and use Judd to mentor him......Judd has mentored Bell in the hope he could take the mantle but the latter isnt up to playing consistent football every game and remains a spasmodic commodity that hasnt taken the next step.....

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #93 – January 13, 2015, 02:45:26 pm

Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 on January 13, 2015, 02:21:42 pm

Big test for Murphy and Gibbs when Judd retires and they dont have the big body in the packs to help them out and take the best taggers each week...Malthouse needs to blood Cripps this season to take over from Judd and use Judd to mentor him......Judd has mentored Bell in the hope he could take the mantle but the latter isnt up to playing consistent football every game and remains a spasmodic commodity that hasnt taken the next step.....

Perfect summation.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #94 – January 13, 2015, 03:43:02 pm

Quote from: Gointocarlton on January 12, 2015, 07:38:26 pm

@Blueforlife
Your point is valid. I know it wasn't finals but when the Tiggers strung 9 in a row last year to make finals, did they give a fork about who the opposition was? Did they have enough A graders? Just saying that if you have the right attitude, you can achieve stuff you wouldn't otherwise.

I agree, but the Tigers won't be winning a flag any time soon.
I think Malthouse will get the best out of us and I think we saw a bit of that last year even though our results weren't flash, but we'll pull up short no matter how well we gel as a team because we lack class.
Jamison is our best defender but he wouldn't hold a candle to Matthew Scarlett, Carrazzo is our grunt player but he's well behind Sam Mitchell, with Betts gone we have no mobile forward with flair who kicks goals like Steve Johnson or Rioli, and we have no high class tall forwards at all.
Even with a full list and all firing the only way we'll beat Hawthorn is if they have a spate of injuries or kick a bucket load of points.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #95 – January 13, 2015, 03:51:31 pm

Quote from: blue4life on January 13, 2015, 03:43:02 pm

Quote from: Gointocarlton on January 12, 2015, 07:38:26 pm
@Blueforlife
Your point is valid. I know it wasn't finals but when the Tiggers strung 9 in a row last year to make finals, did they give a fork about who the opposition was? Did they have enough A graders? Just saying that if you have the right attitude, you can achieve stuff you wouldn't otherwise.

I agree, but the Tigers won't be winning a flag any time soon.
I think Malthouse will get the best out of us and I think we saw a bit of that last year even though our results weren't flash, but we'll pull up short no matter how well we gel as a team because we lack class.
Jamison is our best defender but he wouldn't hold a candle to Matthew Scarlett, Carrazzo is our grunt player but he's well behind Sam Mitchell, with Betts gone we have no mobile forward with flair who kicks goals like Steve Johnson or Rioli, and we have no high class tall forwards at all.
Even with a full list and all firing the only way we'll beat Hawthorn is if they have a spate of injuries or kick a bucket load of points.

A grade players come into their own when the stakes are high, e.g. finals. A team may get to the finals via dedication, heroics and bravery but if it lacks the required level of A grade players it will eventually get found out.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #96 – January 13, 2015, 04:00:56 pm

Quote from: cookie2 on January 13, 2015, 03:51:31 pm

A grade players come into their own when the stakes are high, e.g. finals. A team may get to the finals via dedication, heroics and bravery but if it lacks the required level of A grade players it will eventually get found out.

My feelings exactly cookie.
Sydney wasn't a side loaded with talent but they knit together well and are very disciplined and well coached, but when it came down to it they had their pants pulled down, like Port did against Geelong a while back.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #97 – January 13, 2015, 05:31:34 pm

To have a better record than Ratten...

Malthouse was hired to win a Premiership... no doubts. He and the club has changed the goalposts these last 18 months, ever so subtlety.

This is no HIS team. This is a rebuilding and growing year, Top 8 would be a bonus. win 10 games should be the mark. If they improve and show signs of growth, Malthouse will get another contract... if the stagnate (and the last 2 years they have gone backwards), then a fresh new coach will have a chance to build with this group.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #98 – January 13, 2015, 08:47:38 pm

Quote from: cookie2 on January 13, 2015, 03:51:31 pm

Quote from: blue4life on January 13, 2015, 03:43:02 pm
Quote from: Gointocarlton on January 12, 2015, 07:38:26 pm
@Blueforlife
Your point is valid. I know it wasn't finals but when the Tiggers strung 9 in a row last year to make finals, did they give a fork about who the opposition was? Did they have enough A graders? Just saying that if you have the right attitude, you can achieve stuff you wouldn't otherwise.

I agree, but the Tigers won't be winning a flag any time soon.
I think Malthouse will get the best out of us and I think we saw a bit of that last year even though our results weren't flash, but we'll pull up short no matter how well we gel as a team because we lack class.
Jamison is our best defender but he wouldn't hold a candle to Matthew Scarlett, Carrazzo is our grunt player but he's well behind Sam Mitchell, with Betts gone we have no mobile forward with flair who kicks goals like Steve Johnson or Rioli, and we have no high class tall forwards at all.
Even with a full list and all firing the only way we'll beat Hawthorn is if they have a spate of injuries or kick a bucket load of points.

A grade players come into their own when the stakes are high, e.g. finals. A team may get to the finals via dedication, heroics and bravery but if it lacks the required level of A grade players it will eventually get found out.

Fair point Cookie....Brian Lake wasnt A grade at the Bulldogs and looked washed up..next thing you know he is a Norm Smith Medallist, Premiership player and that make him an A grader when it counted...

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #99 – January 13, 2015, 09:42:30 pm

I don't know EB, Lake certainly looked like an A grader when we played the Scraggers. Remember the game where he played on Setanta and took about a thousand marks?

His form was down and he was playing injured at the end of his time with Footscray but I think his best with them was better than his best with the Hawks.

Cookie's point is certainly valid though; good players are even better when they are in strong teams. That was the point I was trying to make, but in reverse, when I said that Lewis wouldn't be as good if he was playing for us.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #100 – January 13, 2015, 11:25:47 pm

I think we thought when he went to the Hawks he was struggling a bit and wasn't the player he used to be.
There's no doubt that at his best at the Bulldogs he was an A grader

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #101 – January 14, 2015, 12:00:14 am

Quote from: Lods on January 13, 2015, 11:25:47 pm

I think we thought when he went to the Hawks he was struggling a bit and wasn't the player he used to be.
There's no doubt that at his best at the Bulldogs he was an A grader

I agree. He was on a downward spiral at the dogs, and his best was far behind him. Once he moved to the Hawks he had the support of Gibson, Birchall, Hodge and others to make him look good because he wasn't a one man show in the back 50m. He looked far better, but I think his best was at a younger age at the Dogs.

Playing against us made him look elite because we basically kicked it over our target forwards and straight into his hands. How many uncontested marks did he take in his best games against us ? Way too many, because we just didn't have the skills to hit targets. Its easy to make players look better than they really are, when they don't have to defend. Mind you he is a good defender. Without a doubt an "A" grader, but poor delivery has made him look better than he really is. Scarlett and Silvagni along with Fletcher have been way better defenders in their best days, and they have had far more years of being elite than Lake ever will. IMO.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #102 – January 14, 2015, 11:47:42 am

Lets face it, we were absolute crap for much of last year.

There is no reason we should not sneak into the 8, but I will settle on big performances against big teams.

North Melb are crap, there is no way on earth they should finish ahead of us.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #103 – January 14, 2015, 01:17:15 pm

Quote from: cimm1979 on January 14, 2015, 11:47:42 am

Lets face it, we were absolute crap for much of last year.

There is no reason we should not sneak into the 8, but I will settle on big performances against big teams.

North Melb are crap, there is no way on earth they should finish ahead of us.

That's just it though. We ended up in the bottom half of the ladder so we play all the bottom teams twice as opposed to last year playing all the top 8 teams twice. We have a huge opportunity.

BTW I totally disagree about North.

Re: Pass Mark 2015

Reply #104 – January 14, 2015, 01:38:55 pm

Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on January 14, 2015, 01:17:15 pm

BTW I totally disagree about North.

When you draft a player like Waite who is on the wrong side of 30 and injury prone, and you are pinning your hopes on him taking you to the next step, I dont think they are headed in the right direction either TBH. Coupled with an aging Harvey, Petrie (slightly older than Waite), not good I reckon. They have the 2nd oldest list in the comp behind Freo just.