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Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #90 –
Quote from: cookie2 on
Paul we have chosen our path and commited to it. We have to make it work. We can't fall back to an old and unsuccessful formula. It's make it  or who knows how long in oblivion.

At the time MM was sacked, Rob Walls stated that it would be 3 to 4 years minimum before we could even think about finals. We certainly won't get there this year, and I don't think we'll get there in 2018 either. 2019, 2020 is a best case scenario.

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #91 –
Quote from: PaulP on
At the time MM was sacked, Rob Walls stated that it would be 3 to 4 years minimum before we could even think about finals. We certainly won't get there this year, and I don't think we'll get there in 2018 either. 2019, 2020 is a best case scenario.

A fair assessment.
Reality always wins in the end.
 

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #92 –
Quote from: BlueAvenger on
Look, i can understand the impatience as we haven't had any real success in 15 years, but we are starting again.

I must admit i am a sore loser and as impatient as the next bloke but we need to give these guys time to develop.

Losing Kreuzer and Daisy really hurt.

MK is a bull in form that really adds that extra grunt mid to give Cripps, Murph and Gibbs a chop out.
Daisy even though he is grossly overpaid (not his fault), cant kick over a jam tin anymore, and lacks a yard of pace is still an experienced senior player who directs traffic and is only viewed by all us experts as a list clogger. His role in the team is important for the young blokes IMO. I hope they are both back in next week.

Polson, SPS, Pickett and Fisher all have elite speed and skill sets and will complement the bull Cripps in years to come.

Williamson is a jet. Could be anything but i think he will be another big quick mid once he builds his tank.

C. Curnow had 19 touches and 8 marks. Impressed with his game (his 10th) just in case anyone forgot.

Marchbank, Plowman and Macreadie and Docherty form the nucleus of a superior backline for 10+ years.

Matty Wright. Will probably play another 5 years with us but i'd love to see him back to his old role of high half forward. Played on a wing because Daisy was out.

My god if Weitering got some decent F50 entries he would be clunking a few but our mids are moving it too damn slow allowing defensive structures to be set up in our F50. If he was getting some decent delivery he could kick 40 goals plus. But it takes time.

We need to be patient as much as it hurts watching us get pantsed, we really need this new young brigade to play 50 games together as a unit. Then things will start to happen.

This is our first true re-build in how long?? This is a new Carlton and we are going to experience many ups and downs.

Buckle up your seat belts and enjoy the ride people.

Agree with all points. Best balanced post I've read in a long time.

We all want the rebuild but part of it is these sorts of performances - we all have to accept the pain in doing it properly.

My only 'small' concern is whether theres a point when playing too many kids actually slows their development. Still I shall trust the club - hopefully playing the amount of kids we have this year is the best long term plan.

 

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #93 –
Quote from: flyboy77 on
Anyone going to have a crack at the pathetic coaching performance last night?

Ignore the rebuild for the moment, the speed of ball movement (and I admittedly tuned out during Q3) was glacial.....

Apparently, it's not rocket science.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-04-21/sideway-tigers-direct-ball-movement-a-key-to-start-caracella

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #94 –
Quote from: Gointocarlton on
I want to know why our opposition manage to get separation on our blokes so easily? We get murdered on the spread btw the 50's and oppo fowards often mark hands out on a lead.
In contrast, our ability to spread is terrible and our fwd are always being asked to pack mark and crumb.
Our set up and running patterns need alot of work.
 

THIS, THIS,  THIS ^^^^^^^
They are ball watches. Need to take a seat out there with them to take the weight off their legs.
2024... Moir of the same to come

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #95 –
Quote from: shawny on
Agree with all points. Best balanced post I've read in a long time.

We all want the rebuild but part of it is these sorts of performances - we all have to accept the pain in doing it properly.

My only 'small' concern is whether theres a point when playing too many kids actually slows their development. Still I shall trust the club - hopefully playing the amount of kids we have this year is the best long term plan.

Agreed & agreed. We need to be patient.

My concern? By the time we hit our straps in 2-3 years Murphy, Gibbs & Kruz will be in the twilight of their careers and won't be able to ride the wave with us. Gibbs will be gone anyway. Lets trade him away for something at the end of the season - but not be too greedy like we were last season.

We need to start building a succession plan.

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #96 –
Gibbs had a poor game, but I think he's been playing well until that game.  As someone else said, he dislocated/broke his thumb early on.  I don't think we should trade him out on that game.  He is still one of our most skillful players.

Last night was just terrible.  Port were always going to belt us no matter what, they had something to prove after losing games to us in the past few years that they had to win - there's no way they were not smashing us last night.

No point going over anything about the young guys, they looked like children out there playing against grown men - which they are!  We have some real talent in there though, and with plenty of hard work we will come good.  I have faith!

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #97 –
Quote from: Professer E on
p.s. I reckon Murphy has had so much shoulder surgery (e.g. rotator cuff) and associated issues that he can barely lift his arm above the perpendicular, like myself.  Makes tackling weak.  I don't think its a will issue but a physical limitation.

Didn't he lay 8 or 9 tackles v The drug cheats?

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #98 –
Quote from: LP on
And so it begins, so predictable.

Not even 1hr after the final siren we are front page in The Hun!

Fans slam AFL’s decision to fixture Carlton on Friday night after blowout against Port Adelaide

Herald Sun 22 minutes ago

THE AFL’s fixturing for Friday night matches is back on the agenda after a blowout at Adelaide Oval that saw Port Adelaide thump Carlton.

The Blues were a major disappointment as they fielded a young team that was no match for the Power, with the game effectively over five minutes into the third term.

Carlton was blown away in that quarter, failing to register a possession inside 50 from just two entries, while Port Adelaide had 16 scoring shots to blow the lead out to 79 points at the final break.

With two NRL matches and the start of the A-League finals to compete with, some footy fans took to social media to declare they’d switched off the AFL in favour of a more competitive and thus entertaining match.

Follow
Matt @Mattys123
Two NRL thrillers and the A League first final goes to extra time. Yep. If you are still watching the AFL tonight, you're doing it wrong
9:52 PM - 21 Apr 2017
Retweets   5 5 likes

This year the AFL has tried to fixture the better performing teams of recent seasons in the marquee slot after the league was criticised for scheduling big but underperforming clubs on Friday nights, which resulted in a poor spectacle.

The good news is fans won’t see Carlton on a Friday night again this year.

Reigning premiers Western Bulldogs have eight Friday night matches this year but winless Sydney also has eight games in the marquee slot.

Next week Friday night footy should produce a better contest between the Bulldogs and flag favourites the Giants, who will play their first ever Friday night game.

Follow
Aubrey Hamlett ???? @aubreyhamlett
What a woeful match of Friday night footy #AFLpowerblues
9:33 PM - 21 Apr 2017 · Melbourne, Victoria
Retweets   1 1 like
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Mark Riley @MiSeRay
Worse game of Football I have watched all year. Definitely not worthy of a Friday Night game #AFLPowerBlues
9:33 PM - 21 Apr 2017
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Damian Glass @DGlass_official
Can we not fixture Carlton on Friday night footy for at least the next three years? Ruined another night. #AFLPowerBlues
9:32 PM - 21 Apr 2017
9 9 Retweets   29 29 likes
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Matt Bryant @MattBryant15
I hope the next time I see Carlton on Friday night, Channel 7 will be advertising the 2020 Olympics is only weeks away. #AFLPowerBlues
10:16 PM - 21 Apr 2017
Retweets   1 1 like
1h

Channel 7 ✔ @Channel7
Can the Blues come from behind? LIVE on 7 and 7mate now... …
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Ray Cameron @bombersfan63
@Channel7 Friday night footy tonight is a flop ???? Sadly.#aflpowerblues
10:15 PM - 21 Apr 2017
1 1 Retweet   likes
Follow

Anthony Kernich @AntJKernich
why did the AFL let a train wreck into Friday Night #aflpowerblues #afl
10:10 PM - 21 Apr 2017
Retweets   likes

Nothing like trying to kick us when we are down. I wouldn't worry about this bunch of zeroes. They are truly irrelevant. They can follow themselves until the end of the Universe and nothing of interest or import will come from them.

That said, we need to be more competitive each week. For the first time this season we were not. It just happened to be on a Friday night.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #99 –
Quote from: madbluboy on
The stats are flawed. Docherty, Simpson, Gibbs and Murphy were all well beaten today.
And yet they were still among our better players. That just about says everything in itself.

Even Cripps, who had serious leather poisoning, could not be said to have beaten his man. For at least some of the time he was on Ollie Wines, who was excellent for Port.
About the only guy who could say he won his spot would be Casboult and for half the game we couldn't get it near him.

I think the only thing we can do is put this one down to experience and plan for next week. Our players will not be that ordinary again. And hopefully we'll have Kreuzer back.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #100 –
Quote from: PaulP on
Apparently, it's not rocket science.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-04-21/sideway-tigers-direct-ball-movement-a-key-to-start-caracella

it was pure madness the persistent do nothing/sideways kicking that simply allowed every port player to flood back and then we panicked and coughed it up.....
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #101 –
Bolton can go on about green shoots and not getting too low etc, but when you haven't played in a state for a few years and put up a showing like that you will lose juniors in SA.
Rusted on supporters will keep going because it is ingrained but for young-uns you tend to follow the better teams. (see Hawthorn Band wagon)
Very poor showing by the club for SA supporters.
2024... Moir of the same to come

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #102 –
Quote from: flyboy77 on
it was pure madness the persistent do nothing/sideways kicking that simply allowed every port player to flood back and then we panicked and coughed it up.....

At least in the Ratten days we had some enjoyment of kicking goals. It was fun to watch. We just couldn't stop them kicking them the other way :o
2024... Moir of the same to come

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #103 –
With a team of toddlers the result was always going to be a loss. 90 points is pretty disappointing but primarily a result of the third quarter lapse.

The most frustrating aspect was the poor goal kicking. We got the ball inside enough times to make the game closer in the first half but wasted opportunities ities. Murphy's miss, along with other muffed kicks made the task harder.

Good to see c. Curnow play his best game. He got to enough contests and showed he can drag down contested marks. Keep it up. Cripps played very well but struggled to get free, and fisher got a bit of the ball later on and didn't waste it too much. Great game from rowe who kept dixon quiet when the ball was flying in fast.

Potting gibbs has become a past time for many. I thought he played well, and got his hands dirty after hurting his thumb. Easy for us to be critical from the cheap seats. He has limitations but remains one of our best.

Good to see casboult kick a few and get more involved in the second half.  I thouht he cost us the first 2 PA goals by being tentative and not breaking a pack and the ball got run out easily. For a bloke his size he should be able to hurt opponents more. Perhaps it is his character, but we could really use a big bruiser up forward that puts a knee into the defenders. Rocca needs to feed him angry pills.

As a couple of others have pointed out, we missed Kruezer and his follow up work in the middle and missed thomas who has played a role to organise many of the younger players. We are playing to a clearer structure this year, but it is one that breaks down without good leadership and discipline.

Docherty is struggling this year, the result of being attended to by the opposition. With simpson likely to retire at the end of the year we will be looking for an established half back methinks in the trade period.

All in all we got another game into very young players.  By mid season we will be playing schmedts and palmer and co so as to stop the bleeding and the teenagers get tired. There is clearly a longer game being played and it is working.

Re: 2017 Round 5: Post Game Prognostications: Carlton vs Port Adelaide

Reply #104 –
Quote from: BlueAvenger on
Look, i can understand the impatience as we haven't had any real success in 15 years, but we are starting again.

I must admit i am a sore loser and as impatient as the next bloke but we need to give these guys time to develop.

Losing Kreuzer and Daisy really hurt.

MK is a bull in form that really adds that extra grunt mid to give Cripps, Murph and Gibbs a chop out.
Daisy even though he is grossly overpaid (not his fault), cant kick over a jam tin anymore, and lacks a yard of pace is still an experienced senior player who directs traffic and is only viewed by all us experts as a list clogger. His role in the team is important for the young blokes IMO. I hope they are both back in next week.

Polson, SPS, Pickett and Fisher all have elite speed and skill sets and will complement the bull Cripps in years to come.

Williamson is a jet. Could be anything but i think he will be another big quick mid once he builds his tank.

C. Curnow had 19 touches and 8 marks. Impressed with his game (his 10th) just in case anyone forgot.

Marchbank, Plowman and Macreadie and Docherty form the nucleus of a superior backline for 10+ years.

Matty Wright. Will probably play another 5 years with us but i'd love to see him back to his old role of high half forward. Played on a wing because Daisy was out.

My god if Weitering got some decent F50 entries he would be clunking a few but our mids are moving it too damn slow allowing defensive structures to be set up in our F50. If he was getting some decent delivery he could kick 40 goals plus. But it takes time.

We need to be patient as much as it hurts watching us get pantsed, we really need this new young brigade to play 50 games together as a unit. Then things will start to happen.

This is our first true re-build in how long?? This is a new Carlton and we are going to experience many ups and downs.

Buckle up your seat belts and enjoy the ride people.

Spot on. Well said.

Only human nature as we watched last night to feel bitterly disappointed. As BA pointed out so well, we're at the very beginning of climbing a big mountain (after years of terrible neglect/short-sightedness) and last night we stumbled badly. I like how BB stood firm on our direction and took the failure of last night in his stride - could be a steep learning curve for him too!! I just hope the Adelaide bloke is the right mentor (mate of the CEO concerns me), personally I'd rather someone as his mentor who is/was a CFC person and carries/carried our culture/success in their blood. A Parko type... another excellent teacher. Or even a Matthews or Roos.

Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17