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Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #60 –
Quote from: Gozza on
Quote from: Mantis on
Your correct Tex. You don't need alcohol in Australia to have a good time.

I have a different philosophy and a very simple rule to live by: if you can't handle your grog, stay away from it. Simple.  :)
 
Too many d1ckbrains getting on the piss who can't handle it.

Very, very good point, and don't go out in public if you know you get angry easily. In fact don't trust your own judgement. Ask your friend if you are a flog or not. If he says you can behave like a prick at times, stay home and watch your sports on the TV. Either this or book yourself in for anger management classes.
This digital world is too much for us insects to understand.

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #61 –
Quote from: Gozza on
Quote from: Mantis on
Your correct Tex. You don't need alcohol in Australia to have a good time.

I have a different philosophy and a very simple rule to live by: if you can't handle your grog, stay away from it. Simple.  :)
 
Too many d1ckbrains getting on the piss who can't handle it.
Thats the issue though, isn't it? People don't know when the stop - they are not capable of knowing when they can, or cannot handle it.
I think we all speak from experience there. So, what I suggested in the last post was some external force being placed upon people to curb the violence...curb the point at which people become so far gone (which the study suggests is post 3am iirc)

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #62 –
Quote from: Mantis on
Quote from: Gozza on
Quote from: Mantis on
Your correct Tex. You don't need alcohol in Australia to have a good time.

I have a different philosophy and a very simple rule to live by: if you can't handle your grog, stay away from it. Simple.  :)
 
Too many d1ckbrains getting on the piss who can't handle it.

Very, very good point, and don't go out in public if you know you get angry easily. In fact don't trust your own judgement. Ask your friend if you are a flog or not. If he says you can behave like a prick at times, stay home and watch your sports on the TV. Either this or book yourself in for anger management classes.
But this is silly, it does not happen.
You're asking a 19-29 yo male to enrol himself in anger management classes.
You might as well de-ball him while you're at it.

Alco-pops tax was nice in theory - but seemed to have backfired in that twelvies now buy their own spirits and mix it (incorrectly) getting even more hammered than what they were before.

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #63 –
Quote from: tex on
Quote from: Mantis on
Quote from: Gozza on
Quote from: Mantis on
Your correct Tex. You don't need alcohol in Australia to have a good time.

I have a different philosophy and a very simple rule to live by: if you can't handle your grog, stay away from it. Simple.  :)
 
Too many d1ckbrains getting on the piss who can't handle it.

Very, very good point, and don't go out in public if you know you get angry easily. In fact don't trust your own judgement. Ask your friend if you are a flog or not. If he says you can behave like a prick at times, stay home and watch your sports on the TV. Either this or book yourself in for anger management classes.
But this is silly, it does not happen.
You're asking a 19-29 yo male to enrol himself in anger management classes.
You might as well de-ball him while you're at it.

Alco-pops tax was nice in theory - but seemed to have backfired in that twelvies now buy their own spirits and mix it (incorrectly) getting even more hammered than what they were before.

What about 10 dollar cask wine?  ;D

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #64 –
And people will come in suggesting that harsher penalties are necessary and judges are soft blah blah blah.

I think, what needs to be considered, is if you send someone to jail for knocking someone out when they're drunk then;
-you're placing - usually quite (soberly) decent people in an environment where they may be further corrupted and may come out worse than before
- you're placing a huge economic burden on the state
- you're not addressing the problem - an addiction to, or inability to handle alcohol. Drunk people won't think "Oh I went to jail over this last year, I better not knock him out this time."

Jail is not an option for these guys.

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #65 –
Quote from: Gozza on
Quote from: tex on
Quote from: Mantis on
Quote from: Gozza on
Quote from: Mantis on
Your correct Tex. You don't need alcohol in Australia to have a good time.

I have a different philosophy and a very simple rule to live by: if you can't handle your grog, stay away from it. Simple.  :)
 
Too many d1ckbrains getting on the piss who can't handle it.

Very, very good point, and don't go out in public if you know you get angry easily. In fact don't trust your own judgement. Ask your friend if you are a flog or not. If he says you can behave like a prick at times, stay home and watch your sports on the TV. Either this or book yourself in for anger management classes.
But this is silly, it does not happen.
You're asking a 19-29 yo male to enrol himself in anger management classes.
You might as well de-ball him while you're at it.

Alco-pops tax was nice in theory - but seemed to have backfired in that twelvies now buy their own spirits and mix it (incorrectly) getting even more hammered than what they were before.

What about 10 dollar cask wine?  ;D
Christ, people only need try that once to never do it again.


::
I think its a culture thing... Probably take another couple of generations to change. Other countries - like Germany - can drink a lot, but don't put up with such idiotic behaviour like we do. Personally, I think it will - with appropriate education in the community - go the way of smoking, and people will be socially ostracised when they become drunken idiots.

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #66 –
Tex. I love ya to bits. Please understand that drinking might not be the only key issue here. Sure violence is more common with the consumption with alcohol. However those that are naturally mean and angry, and with issues do not need alcohol to tip them off to be nasty aggressive people. In fact to take all alcohol off the shelves would only push them to take exotic drugs as your study shows. I understand your studies. I understand the figures. Do we blame every action on what people have taken ? Alcohol doesn't make a mild mannered citizen a violent killer. Its their basic nature that does.

Idiots don't need a trigger at all times, its just something that helps set them off. How many of us know many happy drunks that have great natures and just laugh when they are heavily under the influence of the amber fluid. Alcohol doesn't stop the problem at all times. Sure it helps but we need to get deep down to the real issues. I know you said anger management against 19 to 29 year old males means taking away their balls in the process. Something along those lines anyway. Their violent behaviour needs to be put in line. Not just their drinking habbits. Why do I say this ? Give them some and then watch them go. Then you will see some real trouble. What you ingest doesn't always make you a prick. If your a prick, you need help.

Influences in our systems bring out the worst in us as humans. Drugs don't make us evil. What we are makes us what we are because of what we have learned to become. Yes we gat a little foolish at times but our own education and experiences as children moulds us to be what we really are. Nice people, primitive animals, or just plain pricks. Don't blame substances all the time. A prick is a prick sober or under the influence of any drug. Sorry Tex not going against you because I understand your point, but looking at the cost to society means any lives saved, or any harm removed is the ultimate solution.

Educate the youth as best you can, and punish those that cross the line. Its a never win situation, but like the road toll it van be minimised. They increased the penalties for drink driving and for all the road offences. They put more police on the roads we drive. Hence our road toll is as low as it was back something like 15 to 20 years when we had 5 million lees population. It comes at a cost, but how much do put on a human life. When you say cost its a dollar value, but when a person dies what dollar value is the to the community, state, or federal government. What is a human life worth dead, or seriously damaged for their entire life ?

Sorry Tex its like I am having a go at you, but I really am not. I just hate this issue where we point the blame. The blame at what ? Idiots ? Or do we justify their behaviour on what they take ?
This digital world is too much for us insects to understand.

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #67 –
Top post Mantis.  Very well said
Reality is an illusion, caused by a lack of alcohol...

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #68 –
My mates reckon I am an absolute scream when I get pissed.  ;D

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #69 –
Quote from: Mantis on
Tex. I love ya to bits. Please understand that drinking might not be the only key issue here. Sure violence is more common with the consumption with alcohol. However those that are naturally mean and angry, and with issues do not need alcohol to tip them off to be nasty aggressive people. In fact to take all alcohol off the shelves would only push them to take exotic drugs as your study shows. I understand your studies. I understand the figures. Do we blame every action on what people have taken ? Alcohol doesn't make a mild mannered citizen a violent killer. Its their basic nature that does.

I understand that each person is different but.....the alcoholics that I know are tremendous people with hearts of gold.....until they get drunk. Then they're not themselves, they turn violent and aggressive. Without alcohol they are upstanding people.

Drugs are drugs, they ruin lives. Just because the government makes a shightload of $ from the sales of alcohol and therefore it is deemed socially acceptable doesn't mean it doesn't destroy lives. Let's not miss the big picture here.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #70 –
What do we define as and alcoholic? Once a week? Twice a week? Several times a week?

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #71 –
Quote from: Gozza on
What do we define as and alcoholic? Once a week? Twice a week? Several times a week?

Anyone with alcohol 'issues', has an alcohol problem. Frequency is not a factor, behaviour is.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #72 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Gozza on
What do we define as and alcoholic? Once a week? Twice a week? Several times a week?

Anyone with alcohol 'issues', has an alcohol problem. Frequency is not a factor, behaviour is.

So therefore I don't have a problem because Iddon't go out and whack people....I'm actually quite jovial.  :D

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #73 –
Quote from: Gozza on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Gozza on
What do we define as and alcoholic? Once a week? Twice a week? Several times a week?

Anyone with alcohol 'issues', has an alcohol problem. Frequency is not a factor, behaviour is.

So therefore I don't have a problem because Iddon't go out and whack people....I'm actually quite jovial.  :D

True but it drains you of your ambition does it not? Prevents you from finding work or a career path to take? So in a way, your alcoholism doesn't seem to affect others around you which is a good thing but it certainly affects you.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Soccer fans' behaviour

Reply #74 –
I think what Carrots is saying is alcoholism isnt a problem for people who dont drink to get drunk.

I.e.  those who enjoy a drink or two with a friend, savour the flavour and bond over a few drinks, rather than get drunk to experience a different perspective.

Up to you which you fit into Gozza.  You might be able to enjoy a slab with a mate and stay relatively normal.  That just means you are poisoning your body with alcohol but aside from that not doing too much wrong.

I know some people that are messy drunks, and I know others that are aggressive drunks.  Sometimes they are one and the same, but usually I avoid their company because being from the category of someone who enjoys to bond over a couple of drinks eventually the other types tend to just bring you down as they stop bonding and start getting inebriated and incoherent.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson