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Topic: Football Department Review (Read 180192 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Review

Reply #105 –
Would be interested to gauge opinions.....IF....and only asking the question here.....if Teague was moved on, in all honesty, what are the coaching options available to us? We surely don't go down the path of an untried senior coach again? You would only move Teague on if there's a better option.....outside of Clarkson or Lyon, who would we seriously consider? Is Brad Scott one that would be on the list?

Re: Review

Reply #106 –
Quote from: WASurfer – on
Would be interested to gauge opinions.....IF....and only asking the question here.....if Teague was moved on, in all honesty, what are the coaching options available to us? We surely don't go down the path of an untried senior coach again? You would only move Teague on if there's a better option.....outside of Clarkson or Lyon, who would we seriously consider? Is Brad Scott one that would be on the list?

That's been tried before - starting with Parkin through to Bolton, we have oscillated between young buck and old fart with resounding success. Parkin, Brittain, Pagan, Ratten, Malthouse, Bolton. Teague breaks the trend, but not for long it seems lol.

Bolton is a Clarkson mini me according to Jordan Lewis, and nobody liked the damage limitation style he employed. I watched Clarkson's presser after the Blues Hawks game. Obviously taking a sneaky cheap shot at Teague, he said something like "putting speed on the ball is good if you have composure, but if you don't, it's a problem" (I don't remember the exact words). How much composure do we have ? Close to zero. Therefore Clarkson will play just like the Hawks do now and just like Bolton did. And so for that matter will Lyon IMHO.

Re: Review

Reply #107 –
Quote from: WASurfer – on
Would be interested to gauge opinions.....IF....and only asking the question here.....if Teague was moved on, in all honesty, what are the coaching options available to us? We surely don't go down the path of an untried senior coach again? You would only move Teague on if there's a better option.....outside of Clarkson or Lyon, who would we seriously consider? Is Brad Scott one that would be on the list?
Lyon isn't really an option, he is Malthouse like in that he's taken the same game plan to the different venues and built a list to suit, that would mean throwing out much of what we've got. Our list of skinnies does not suit a Lyon game plan and never will. But I suppose if you think what we've got is mostly worthless then maybe it's feasible we need another rebuild.

Clarkson is more likely to make use of what we've got, would it be better use of what we've got, that is hard to say. Would he have any real pull to change club culture, well Malthouse didn't why would Clarkson. The real drivers of change in the Dawks club culture was initially Ian Dicker, then Jason Dunstall as CEO who basically prevented Kennett from laying waste to all the progress!

Anyway, if it's a Clarkson or Lyon driving club culture, why do we even need that, it's that a matter for the Board and Executive?

Is changing the coach fundamentally the Board and Executive obfuscating responsibility for cultural change? I'd suggest what Dicker and Dunstall did at the Dawks was the exact opposite, they could have folded under Kennett's pressure and Clarkson might have been kyboshed, it was sticking the coarse under those pressures that got the Dawks where they wanted to be!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Review

Reply #108 –
Quote from: WASurfer – on
Would be interested to gauge opinions.....IF....and only asking the question here.....if Teague was moved on, in all honesty, what are the coaching options available to us? We surely don't go down the path of an untried senior coach again? You would only move Teague on if there's a better option.....outside of Clarkson or Lyon, who would we seriously consider? Is Brad Scott one that would be on the list?
To reiterate, if they knife Teague I'm done.
Candidates
Hardwick - Yes (employed but we must ask the question with an intent to make a serious play)
Clarkson - Yes with the aim to groom a young assistant
Lyon - Yes with the aim to groom a young assistant
B Scott - No, seems to have checked out of coaching but is the right type of "kent" our group needs IMO
Worsfold - No (although seems to have proven he can hand over to young bloke who is having an impact)
Leppa - No but as an assistant or Footy Manager Yes
Voss - No but as an assistant or Footy Manager Yes
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership

Re: Review

Reply #109 –
I think Ross is more a re-stump, re-wire, re-plumb kind of guy lol. No rebuilds for him.

Re: Review

Reply #110 –
To copy what has been done before is not the answer ie:

 - Don't copy our last 20 years - it's broke, doesn't work
 - Don't copy anything before the last 20 years - times have changed
 - Don't copy others - once we do that we are behind, as they have already moved on to greater things (which we may have done as per Sydney and Roos in appointing Teague) - we also talk about the Geelong and Richmond reviews particularly.
 - Do tweak other models, put them in our context - use experiences gained.  Keep Teague, get him the help he needs - preferably someone experienced who knows how to win.  Let Teague work on his strengths and someone help back him up with his weaknesses.  IF we back our coach properly, that will build confidence.  Sayers was on the board that appointed Teague.  Back him.  Don't listen to us plebs, we have no idea what's really going on (but we care).
 - Don't listen to uninvited rumour and innuendo.  Pick carefully who to chat with.
 - Be honest about our list and expectations for the rest of the season.

Re: Review

Reply #111 –
'Choco' Williams ??

Re: Review

Reply #112 –
Dodge....that's how I see it playing out. Teague to be retained as senior coach but the rest of the coaching panel/footy department to be revamped completely.

Re: Review

Reply #113 –
If we do keep Teague we have to provide him with the best support we possibly can , including a senior adviser (not one who lives on the other side of the country.)
We also need to guarantee him at least a full two years with no question of replacing him....because a poor start to 2022 and we'd be back here again.
Members and supporters would need to be told that was the plan, and to get on board.

But let's see what the review throws up.
The player interaction is what interests me.
There are obvious issues there...but how deep and far reaching are any divisions.

Re: Review

Reply #114 –
Quote from: WASurfer – on
Dodge....that's how I see it playing out. Teague to be retained as senior coach but the rest of the coaching panel/footy department to be revamped completely.

Same @WASurfer .... too much bl00dy groupthink.  Stamp the authority now.

Re: Review

Reply #115 –
Quote from: WASurfer – on
Dodge....that's how I see it playing out. Teague to be retained as senior coach but the rest of the coaching panel/footy department to be revamped completely.
The two blueprint 'reviews' are Geelong in 2006, and Richmond in 2016.  On both occasions, a coach with middle-of-the-road performance to that point was retained, and in both cases it led to successful eras. 

I don't want to see Teague go either - but he clearly needs a better, more strategic group around him. 

I honestly think we are not that far off jumping up the ladder big time. 

But in words that are generally attributed to Einstein - 'the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result'.  So things must change for us to get better - hence the review.

As a bonus, we have 10 more games of relatively minimal consequence to work out who really wants to be in Navy Blue, and who can play where.

So 2022 starts against the Giants in 2 weeks time.
This is now the longest premiership drought in the history of the Carlton Football Club - more evidence of climate change?

Re: Review

Reply #116 –
Fans think this "review" is leading to some sort of instant renaissance, nothing could be further from the truth.

Unfortunately for Teague, based on the timing, I suspect you likely find players like Cripps and BigH along with anybody else with the inkling of injury,  maybe Williams, Saad and Martin, being packaged up fairly soon and sent off for repairs and renovations to be ready prior to the next pre-season.

"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Review

Reply #117 –
Quote from: Gointocarlton – on
To reiterate, if they knife Teague I'm done.
Candidates
Hardwick - Yes (employed but we must ask the question with an intent to make a serious play)
Clarkson - Yes with the aim to groom a young assistant
Lyon - Yes with the aim to groom a young assistant
B Scott - No, seems to have checked out of coaching but is the right type of "kent" our group needs IMO
Worsfold - No (although seems to have proven he can hand over to young bloke who is having an impact)
Leppa - No but as an assistant or Footy Manager Yes
Voss - No but as an assistant or Footy Manager Yes
I think if one of Hardwick or Clarkson says yes then Teague is finished. Collingwood are in the same boat and it could be a race to entice one of those two to either club and I think thats where we are at now.
Clarkson is finished at Hawthorn and Dimma has bonked his way into trouble at Tigerland and probably needs a fresh start.
IMHO we will only make the change if its seen as replacing Teague with the best in the comp.
The members/supporters will buy it if its a big name coach to replace Teague and Liddle/Lloyd will still have their jobs.

Re: Review

Reply #118 –
EB....I can't see Hardwick moving anywhere in the short term. If anyone does, it'll likely be Clarkson who'll see his race run at Hawthorn....especially if he and the club see Sam Mitchell as the heir apparent and ready to go (those famous words!). I guess then it would be up to Clarkson as to where he sees the best fit for himself, the best list for him to work with etc.

Re: Review

Reply #119 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
Caro reporting that the reason we seem to be in a hurry is because we want to get moving before the pies sack Buckley so we can secure Clarko first.

Of course.

We did the same thing when we sacked Ratten and appointed Malthouse.

Meanwhile, if we are going to move on Teague, the only other senior coach with previous experience worth looking at is Michael Voss.

He would be a much better coach today and Id back him to be much more worthwhile looking at than any other candidate.

Quote from: Hubba – on
Why would we be any harder than Essendon ?  Similar history and expectation.
or Gold Coast and GWS who have big names leave to go home every year and little to no members?



Essendon have had much more stability in their senior coaching roles, and are the darlings of the AFL thanks to Sheedy and his multitude of blockbuster games.  From Anzac day, to dreamtime, to the country game, to any other gimmicky crap you can hang your hat on, EFC have credits in the bank, and have done a lot for the game.

The fans arent so willing to knife their coach at a moments notice either.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson