Re: General Discussions Reply #1095 – July 29, 2022, 08:57:59 pm Quote from: PaulP – on July 29, 2022, 08:38:15 pmthis is what I said :I think there is more than enough time to do your bit, even with the plethora of causes that exist in what is IMO a broken world. You don't have to give your life to a cause, but there are plenty of things to be done, even if they're only small. I emphasize small gestures that are manageable by the average person, and you come out with a hit list that no human could ever meet, and then say I'm a hypocrite. Righto then. Its a quicker version of the same point.I could ask, what have you done in your life to......Save the whales?etc etc etcUntil it gets to the point where you haven't done anything. Then i can call you a hypocrite as you said there was time for all the causes.There simply isn't and no matter which way you slice it, there is simply too much to care about in the world to focus on it all.Quote from: PaulP – on July 29, 2022, 08:38:15 pmIf that's the case, then why not come out and say it, instead of hiding behind some flaky Theological pretense ? It's been obvious all along. All of us are motivated by a need for security, a need to belong, all of us seek validation and acceptance by our tribe and our community. Nobody wants to be ostracized. Being the lone dissenter is worse for some people than being the spare pr1ck at a Jewish wedding. I get it. Why do they need to? There private life is their own.Why do they need to justify anything to anyone. They have their opinion and it is what it is.Do they need to say that when they were younger they were raped by someone while they were wearing a rainbow t-shirt and the rapist commented on the t-shirt and it brings back bad memories and they vowed to never wear anything rainbow again?!Look, i don't know why they have an issue with something seemingly so easy to go along with, and so beneficial to plenty out there.I don't understand it, but i don't need to.The choice is their own....and they are entitled to it. Quote Selected 1 Likes Liked by: Thryleon
Re: General Discussions Reply #1096 – July 29, 2022, 08:58:31 pm Quote from: PaulP – on July 29, 2022, 08:46:32 pmSo if you don't support the pride jumper, and you don't oppose the pride jumper, this means what exactly ?meh. Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1097 – July 29, 2022, 09:04:38 pm Quote from: kruddler – on July 29, 2022, 08:57:59 pmIts a quicker version of the same point.I could ask, what have you done in your life to......Save the whales?etc etc etcUntil it gets to the point where you haven't done anything. Then i can call you a hypocrite as you said there was time for all the causes.There simply isn't and no matter which way you slice it, there is simply too much to care about in the world to focus on it all..............................If you can't be bothered reading what I actually wrote, or if your comprehension skills have slipped since I last frequented these forums, then there's not much to say. Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1098 – July 29, 2022, 09:10:02 pm Quote from: PaulP – on July 29, 2022, 09:04:38 pmIf you can't be bothered reading what I actually wrote, or if your comprehension skills have slipped since I last frequented these forums, then there's not much to say. QuoteI think there is more than enough time to do your bit, even with the plethora of causes that exist in what is IMO a broken world. You don't have to give your life to a cause, but there are plenty of things to be done, even if they're only small.Can you remember what you wrote?What have you done to save the whales? Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1099 – August 01, 2022, 03:15:46 pm Someone had to start this new conversation given the talk about an Indigenous voice in parliament. I want to state that I have no opposition to an indigenous voice in parliament up front, so people can understand that what I am about to state next, doesn't come from anywhere but a genuine confusion on what this whole shemozzle of an idea is about.Parliamentary officials, are elected to represent the people and govern on their behalf. I am genuinely confused, as to why they are now creating a position, which doubles up on their duty. Indigenous people, have the right to vote, and have the ability to vote for their representatives if they wish to do so.What exactly is this whole endeavour for, and whom does it benefit? The answer to me is clear, the pigs at the trough get another position to ensure that no indigenous aspiring politican takes their seat. Id rather see some indigenous people running for seats in the next election, than simply creating yet another virtue signalled position in government.The politicians continue to take the mickey out of us and then ride the gravy train into retirement when people are struggling to put food on the table and power their houses in the current economic environment. Quote Selected 1 Likes Liked by: Professer E
Re: General Discussions Reply #1100 – August 01, 2022, 05:30:49 pm Quote from: Thryleon – on August 01, 2022, 03:15:46 pmSomeone had to start this new conversation given the talk about an Indigenous voice in parliament. I want to state that I have no opposition to an indigenous voice in parliament up front, so people can understand that what I am about to state next, doesn't come from anywhere but a genuine confusion on what this whole shemozzle of an idea is about.Parliamentary officials, are elected to represent the people and govern on their behalf. I am genuinely confused, as to why they are now creating a position, which doubles up on their duty. Indigenous people, have the right to vote, and have the ability to vote for their representatives if they wish to do so.What exactly is this whole endeavour for, and whom does it benefit? The answer to me is clear, the pigs at the trough get another position to ensure that no indigenous aspiring politican takes their seat. Id rather see some indigenous people running for seats in the next election, than simply creating yet another virtue signalled position in government.The politicians continue to take the mickey out of us and then ride the gravy train into retirement when people are struggling to put food on the table and power their houses in the current economic environment. To answer your question.I think its hard for minorities to get majority. Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1101 – August 01, 2022, 05:44:40 pm ^Nope. Anyone who votes is represented by the candidate in their electorate. You have missed my point. Politicians serve their electorate. Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1102 – August 01, 2022, 05:50:20 pm Quote from: Thryleon – on August 01, 2022, 05:44:40 pm^Nope. Anyone who votes is represented by the candidate in their electorate. You have missed my point. Politicians serve their electorate. I get that, but how is a voice going to get into parliament if the minorities can never get a majority?I'm not saying i agree or disagree, just pointing out the opposing view.Whats the alternative? Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1103 – August 01, 2022, 07:41:03 pm Quote from: Thryleon – on August 01, 2022, 05:44:40 pm^Nope. Anyone who votes is represented by the candidate in their electorate. You have missed my point. Politicians serve their electorate. Politicians are in it to get in, serve some time doing SFA, qualify for a pension and then get a free ride for ever. They couldnt give a flying fork about you or I. Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1104 – August 01, 2022, 08:07:35 pm So who is Thorpe representing.... A minority group or the electorate? Government for the 1% or the 99%? Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1105 – August 01, 2022, 08:29:25 pm The end answer (and it won't be in my life time or even my children's....because theres a lot of ground to make up) is that there will come a time when there is no need for a representation of any minority groups...we'll all be accepted as one and the same. Quote Selected
Re: General Discussions Reply #1106 – August 01, 2022, 09:43:22 pm I believe Indigenous voice is about getting recognition of the first peoples into the constitution and then having an advisory group which doesn't fill a full parliamentary function. Prof, Lydia is the other side of the fence to Pauline, so represents the other side of Pauline. Or the way she carries on, just herself. Quote Selected 2 Likes Liked by: LP, DJC
Re: General Discussions Reply #1107 – August 01, 2022, 10:18:24 pm I heard an Aboriginal bloke on the wireless today who gave a very good reason why an Indigenous voice to Parliament would be a good thing.Basically, he said that, as a taxpayer, he was unhappy about the money that is spent on programs for Indigenous folk and doesn’t produce the intended/desired outcomes. He felt that having an Indigenous voice to Parliament would mean that Government funding for Indigenous programs would be better targeted and produce better outcomes. That would be a win-win.The first time I voted in a Commonwealth election, I voted for Neville Bonner who became the first ever Indigenous person in Parliament. However, Senator Bonner and the Indigenous people in the current Parliament are there to represent their electorates, not just Indigenous people (who would make up a small percentage of the voters in most electorates).I don’t know the mechanics of the Indigenous voice, no-one does at this stage, but I am familiar with The Uluru Statement from the Heart. It’s advocating constitutional change to improve representation of Indigenous Australians to the Commonwealth Government. Victoria already has such an arrangement in place and South Australia is establishing its Indigenous representative body. The sky hasn’t fallen in Victoria and I suspect that it won’t in South Australia … or the Commonwealth. Quote Selected 1 Likes Liked by: LP
Re: General Discussions Reply #1108 – August 01, 2022, 11:17:47 pm If you were the folks framing this legislation /ammendment you would want to do extensive polling to make sure it would get up before proceeding. It would be terribly damaging, divisive and disconcerting to indigenous folk if it failed. Quote Selected Last Edit: August 01, 2022, 11:19:50 pm by Lods
Re: General Discussions Reply #1109 – August 02, 2022, 12:05:37 am Quote from: Lods – on August 01, 2022, 11:17:47 pmIf you were the folks framing this legislation /ammendment you would want to do extensive polling to make sure it would get up before proceeding. It would be terribly damaging, divisive and disconcerting to indigenous folk if it failed.Absolutely Lods!The way to kill a referendum is to focus on the detail of the implementation, as Howard did with the monarchy referendum. Success generally comes with a focus on broad principles. The 1967 referendum simply asked whether the constitution should be amended, " to give the Commonwealth Parliament the power to make laws with respect to Aboriginal people in Australia, and to include Aboriginal people in national censuses." The critical factor in the success of the 1967 referendum was that it had bipartisan support and a no case was not presented. If there's a no case this time, it's hard to see how the referendum could succeed. Quote Selected