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Topic: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain (Read 98324 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #165 –
Quote from: Phillipwh – on

ps if he was playing for Carlton I would have thought it highly appropriate

If he played for Carlton we'd worship the ground he walks on, but alas the CFC has no idea how to draft champion footballers at pick 43 in the draft.
We took Kris Massie at 7 and Adam Chatfield at 23 in Goodes' draft.
The only thing in this world worth more than a hill of beans is the Carlton Football Club.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #166 –
If he played for Carlton no one would care about him being booed and he would have been fined for taunting fans last week.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #167 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
If he played for Carlton no one would care about him being booed and he would have been fined for taunting fans last week.

Something tells me this would have been the exact result you indicated.
This digital world is too much for us insects to understand.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #168 –
He wouldn't get the soft umpiring either.
DrE is no more... you ok with that harmonica man?
 

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #169 –
Being O/S I am just catching up with this incident and the debate.

Firstly the argument that it is part of his heritage is false.  Heritage has to go back further than a handful of years to when a few kids made the whole thing up.  I believe such a silly 'jig" was insulting to the cause of Aboriginal Heritage

Secondly the comparison to the Haka is ridiculous as well.  The Haka is done to intimidate the opposition players as a whole - not a few spectators.

Thirdly -and I hesitate to say this for fear of being called racist - but at my first glance on a laptop my first impression reminded me of a chimp charge.  Now please do not accuse me of racism.  Find an appropriate clip and compare before you judge.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #170 –
So that's three racist comments re Goodes on this board in around 4 days. But racism has nothing to do with it. I rest my case.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #171 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots – on
So that's three racist comments re Goodes on this board in around 4 days. But racism has nothing to do with it. I rest my case.

That's your interpretation PI2C.....no-one else's (that's 'cos apparently we're all racist according to you)

Interested to know when you'll be submitting your own nomination to the United Nations?

Grandstanding much.......
Football is life, there is nothing else....

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #172 –
Quote from: blue4life – on
If he played for Carlton we'd worship the ground he walks on, but alas the CFC has no idea how to draft champion footballers at pick 43 in the draft.
We took Kris Massie at 7 and Adam Chatfield at 23 in Goodes' draft.

Kris Massie played over 100 games... I had a look through the 97 draft and was thinking "he wasn't such a bad pick" if you look at the players taken after him... then I got to Simon Black at pick 31 and stopped!  ;D

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #173 –
Quote from: Brettie – on
That's your interpretation PI2C.....no-one else's (that's 'cos apparently we're all racist according to you)
I agree with PI2C.  When you need to preface a comment by saying that you hesitate to make it for fear of it being called racist, that's a pretty good clue that it shouldn't be said. 

There are some associations or words that have a limited geographical history as racist put downs.  For instance, referring to an indigenous youth as a boy or using blackface in impersonations is not likely to spark outrage here though it would create a firestorm in the US.  But comparing blacks to apes or monkeys is incredibly offensive to every black racial grouping.  It's an easy comparison to make given that the apes and monkeys used in those comparisons have dark fur.  Yet we know the physical comparison is just a convenient cover for an assertion that they are sub-human.  Given that African-Americans and Indigenous Australians have unfortunately suffered a history of being subjugated and stripped of rights, that comparison cuts to the core.  Remember how Andrew Symonds reacted when the Indians called him a monkey or the Sri Lankans reacted when the Australian cricketers told them to stop chattering like monkeys?  Remember when there was a furore when Eddie McGuire suggested they should get Goodes to play King Kong?

Why then, knowing that the comparison was problematic, would anyone compare that dance with a chimpanzee charge?  It didn't further the argument being advanced AT ALL.  Was it being suggested that those who created the dance were copying chimpanzees?  If so, that's nonsense.  The dance is a fusion of moves from the traditional dances of various tribes throughout Australia. 

Strangely enough, the chimp charge and battles in which troupes of chimpanzees go to war against each other are often seen as examples in which chimpanzees behave like humans and there has been debate as to whether this is a natural behaviour or one that is influenced by interactions with humans.  These behaviours are often used by evolutionary biologists and "man-watchers" to consider human interactions.  How odd that this is now been inverted by suggesting indigenous Australians are acting like chimpanzees.

I have no doubt that the comment was racist, although that doesn't mean the poster is racist.  It's a good lesson that if any of us has an inkling that a comment (s)he proposes to post could be seen as racist, then don't do it.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #174 –
Quote from: Brettie – on
That's your interpretation PI2C.....no-one else's (that's 'cos apparently we're all racist according to you)

Interested to know when you'll be submitting your own nomination to the United Nations?

Grandstanding much.......

Brettie if you want to put words in my mouth you are not worth debating with.

@Mav

Thank you, and I have no doubt said poster knew exactly what he was doing.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #175 –
Quote from: Bear – on
Kris Massie played over 100 games... I had a look through the 97 draft and was thinking "he wasn't such a bad pick" if you look at the players taken after him... then I got to Simon Black at pick 31 and stopped!  ;D

Black and Nick Stevens were both taken after Adam Chatfield at 23, along with Goodes of course.
1997, the good old days, back when we didn't rebuild and squealed about the draft being a restraint of trade.
Has anything much changed?
The only thing in this world worth more than a hill of beans is the Carlton Football Club.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #176 –
Quote from: blue4life – on
Black and Nick Stevens were both taken after Adam Chatfield at 23, along with Goodes of course.
1997, the good old days, back when we didn't rebuild and squealed about the draft being a restraint of trade.
Has anything much changed?

We don't complain about restraint of trade anymore  :))

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #177 –
Topics such as these always bring out some very strong emotions in folk.
They're issues we have very strong and personal opinions about.

It is an important debate, but it's also a challenging one because we're asked to look at ourselves and examine our own beliefs, values and prejudices.

From that point it is valuable... but there are also some people's beliefs that are set in stone and unchangeable.

People become quite defensive at a suggestion that they might have elements of their makeup that does discriminate on the basis of race, religion etc

Prejudice....like most things, covers a large spectrum of different levels of intolerance.
It can range from extreme violence against a group to a feeling of just being uncomfortable around members of that group, or even a feeling of resentment because of perceived advantage.

While I agree with most of what Mav says, even writing this I feel a need to revise and edit based on how some of it may be misinterpreted.

I think that's a common problem with people discussing issues of discrimination. If you comment you put yourself out there for your prejudices to be exposed and  judged. There's nothing wrong with that. The only danger is folk doing the judging will have their own bias and prejudice.

The issue for us as a group is...
Can we, as a forum, debate such topics without resorting to personal abuse?
Can we keep strong feelings in check and debate the merits of posts rather than attacking the poster?

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #178 –
Quote from: blue4life – on
Black and Nick Stevens were both taken after Adam Chatfield at 23, along with Goodes of course.
1997, the good old days, back when we didn't rebuild and squealed about the draft being a restraint of trade.
Has anything much changed?

I don't acknowledge Stevens (and he ended up with us anyway), Goodes would have been nice... some ordinary footballers selected before both those guys, and Simon Black.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #179 –
Quote from: Bear – on
I don't acknowledge Stevens (and he ended up with us anyway), Goodes would have been nice... some ordinary footballers selected before both those guys, and Simon Black.

My guess is that if Goodes was drafted by CFC, he would've lasted 50 games, gone nowhere, and then been delisted or traded. Players are like seeds. Without fertile soil, good climate, care etc. they don't flourish.