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Defence and percentage

This is probably something that's not surprising given our ladder position... but I wasn't aware of how badly, in comparison to other sides, we're going in the defensive stakes.

We keep lamenting our lack of goal kicking ability but looking at the ladder this morning one of the things that stands out is the number of points scored against us this year.

While our "Points for" are not radically different to the other teams around us at the bottom of the ladder our "Points against" are more than 100 points behind the next highest

Gold Coast 1930
Brisbane 1919
Carlton 2054

We're looking at our worst result since 2007 when we had  a mind numbing 2911 points against.

That rather pathetic result was counter-balanced by the fact we did have some semblance of an attack back then and managed to score 2167 pts leaving us with a percentage of 74.44%

In fact our percentage at the moment is lower than at any time during the dark years.

If we maintain our current percentage, 65.2%, it will be the lowest since 1901

So while there's a bit of work to be done to fix up the attack, our defensive efforts across the ground also need to be addressed.

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #1 –
Quote from: Lods – on

In fact our percentage at the moment is lower than at any time during the dark years..

I think our percentage wasn't so bad until we decided we needed to finish last
 

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #3 –
Quote from: Lods – on
This is probably something that's not surprising given our ladder position... but I wasn't aware of how badly, in comparison to other sides, we're going in the defensive stakes.

We keep lamenting our lack of goal kicking ability but looking at the ladder this morning one of the things that stands out is the number of points scored against us this year.

While our "Points for" are not radically different to the other teams around us at the bottom of the ladder our "Points against" are more than 100 points behind the next highest

Gold Coast 1930
Brisbane 1919
Carlton 2054

We're looking at our worst result since 2007 when we had  a mind numbing 2911 points against.

That rather pathetic result was counter-balanced by the fact we did have some semblance of an attack back then and managed to score 2167 pts leaving us with a percentage of 74.44%

In fact our percentage at the moment is lower than at any time during the dark years.

If we maintain our current percentage, 65.2%, it will be the lowest since 1901

So while there's a bit of work to be done to fix up the attack, our defensive efforts across the ground also need to be addressed.

Its always been a bit alarming.

Without going into stats figures, and the rest of it, since we started "coming good" back at the end of 2008, there always seemed to be patterns of our play that I can often recall commenting to myself and my brother in law the following statements:

1.  You cannot make mistakes like that, and expect to win games of football.  Chris Judd, and Fevola seemed to get us across the line in spite of this sometimes but even they could only do so much.

2.  We are far too easy to score against.

3.  We look like boys playing against men today.

4.  Scoring seems to be a herculean task for us today, and then we would concede one almost instantaneously at the next centre bounce.  (this one was usually against the better sides of the competition).

5.  We cannot seem to string together 4 quarters of good footy.

I was watching the Hawks vs Geelong game (no foxtel and the AFL app kept crashing on me on saturday night although I saw the first quarter before the AFL app bombed out) and there was an interesting stat mentioned about Hawthorn at 3/4 time when they were up by about 4 goals, and on 97 points.  In 82 matches, they have only lost once when they have scored 100 points or more and that was against Geelong with a kick on the siren by Tom Hawkins to win the game a few years ago. 

We seem to be fair way off this, and whilst our best footy has seen us score pretty well, and whilst doing the scoring we were not conceding, we have not looked like showing the sort of form that premiership aspiring teams do at any point during the journey over the last 15 odd years and as soon as momentum swings, we were often accounted for easily enough.

Hopefully that will change soon, but we need to become one of those teams that are tough to play against and can mix it with anyone.  Thats why the second half of last season was so encouraging with so many close fought battles against the top sides even without the wins.  We finally seemed to be trending in the right direction.

This year its all come crashing down again.

I heard Hardwick state in a presser a few years ago, that we need to stop playing on emotion, because when your up your up and when your down you are a non event, and I get the feeling that we have been a very emotional outfit over the last few years. 



"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #4 –
This is a chicken and egg argument that sidetracks real progress.

Percentage is the biggest over-rated stat in the history of team sport. Win games and it fixes itself, it should not be used as part of the recruiting / decision making process. There are far more important stats, 1%ers, heart rates, tackles, efficiency.

Quote from: Thryleon – on
.................. Chris Judd, and Fevola seemed to get us across the line in spite of this sometimes but even they could only do so much..............

The fact that two attacking players were able to influence results is proof positive that percentage and defense is an irrelevant consideration.

Kick more goals than your opponent, use the ball efficiently when you get it, and it all sorts itself out! A defensive focus is dead, it's old fashioned football and doomed to fail because of the way teams structure up. Attack from every line is in and the basics remain, don't give the ball back but don't over-possess it either!

Our team lacks so many basics. Our defenders punch desperately to nobody or even to the opposition, contrast this with players  like Gibson or Lake who punch into the waiting arms of Hodge or Mitchell. That is almost by definition attacking defense! Our forwards miss marks without any intent to bring the ball down to advantage, the Dawks drop marks into the waiting arms of Rioli. Our mids pick up the hot ball and get tackled, or fumble it to the advantage of the opposition, the Dawks fumble to advantage or fail to take possession and win a free. These are the very basics of football, and we show little of them!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #5 –
Our forwards and midfield have always been poor defensively and apply little pressure especially when we're getting smashed. This makes the backline's job very difficult.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #6 –
Wan't is Malcolm Blight who said all you need to do is kick more goals than the opposition? And he won two flags with at Adelaide doing that. But i Think he lost a few at Geelong :o
2025... Moir of the same to come

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #7 –
We are tanking....normal logic cant be applied in our case and blow outs with goals galore kicked against us are part of the deal....

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #8 –
My view is that we have not had the ability to set or maintain a structure or 'shape' on the field. The best teams are able to maintain a shape, or a distribution of players across the field that supports their style of play and their strengths. Hawthorn do it very well, and they have very flexible players. They mostly attack via their flanks and retain the option of centering the ball deep when their ruckman are forward. This has become more the case since franklin left.

Dockers too, maintain a shape that allows runners to get out the back and attack. They tend to be more perfectionist in that they wait a little more for the right option. May explain why they dont tend to kick massive scores, but are good at keeping the opposition down. West coast's defence has been outstanding this year and characterises shape and structure over individuals. Losing their CHB pre season has not seemingly affected them much.

Looking at this season and previous ones, we seem to lack much ability to maintain shape on the field. Players have a limited ability to run to the right places in relation to everyone else so look confused. Backlines that do this are easier to penetrate. Henderson down back can act as the floating backman, but without a bit more structure we leak goals. A midfield that does not defend so well makes the problem worse. A team that can keep structure under pressure can better retain possession in defence.

If there is a major factor in this it is average coaching and/or players that are not learning.

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #9 –
% took a fair whack against Hawthorn.

Good news is for the 'pro-tankers' is that we play Hawks in the last round, again, and would expect another big hit to the %.

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #10 –
Quote from: LP – on

Percentage is the biggest over-rated stat in the history of team sport. Win games and it fixes itself, it should not be used as part of the recruiting / decision making process. There are far more important stats, 1%ers, heart rates, tackles, efficiency.

The fact that two attacking players were able to influence results is proof positive that percentage and defense is an irrelevant consideration.

For an irrelevant stat percentage kind of has a bit of influence. ;) ;D

It can determine minor premiers
It can determine wooden spooners
It can determine a top four finish
It can give you a home final
It can mean you play a final interstate
It can determine whether you play finals at all .....or finish just out of the finals
It can determine draft order.
It can be your best friend...or your worst enemy.
If we are indeed tanking, as some suggest, it may be our most important stat in the weeks ahead.

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #11 –
Adelaide were 9th last week 0.1% behind Geelong. After smashing the bombers and the cats losing they are a game and 10% ahead of the cats now.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: Defence and percentage

Reply #12 –
Percentage will be a column I look at when we win matches. It will then influence where we could be. At the moment it means nothing to me at all. Its obvious how bad we are and what needs to be done.
This digital world is too much for us insects to understand.