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Topic: Rd 15: Post Game Frustrations: Carlton vs Collingwood (Read 51780 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #45 –
Yes, I thought Jack made a positive start for us and did not flinch when he went for the high balls. Pity his debut had to be against the backdrop of such a dismal team effort.
Casboult certainly was right up there with Everitt for crapness and surely will be lucky to survive unless he turns it around very soon?
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #46 –
Jack looked a little uncertain at times which is understandable in your first game but he does seem to know what he's doing. 15 possies 6 marks and 4 tackles. Really should have had 2 goals as well. With him and Charlie and Harry our fwd line looks like it will get better.  That lets us move out underperformers like Everitt and Walker and maybe Casboult, none of whom seem to be able to get enough of the ball on a regular basis. Lamb and Sumner can fight it out for the other small fwd spot.  A bit of competition  between them wont hurt. Also need a really lively goal sneak who can make a goal out of nothing. I'm not going to dwell on how we lost Eddie, we don't have a time machine, but he is the sort of player that would round that fwd line out.

The back 6 looks fairly settled although it is a real shame about Byrne.

We need more toigh and hard running quality on the ball.

A bit more time into the young talent, a couple of good mids, and a quality small fwd and i think we'll have the core of a competitive side. A little bit of skill and luck required at draft and trade time and we might  become a finals side in the next couple of years. But for now we know where we are at. I can see some promising green shoots and that was always what this year was about.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #47 –
We are 14 games into a 66 game rebuild, and last night, that's exactly how we looked - a side that's about 21 % complete.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #48 –
When you look at some of the stats, there's no question that some things are working, but not nearly enough.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #49 –
Quote from: kruddler – on
As a barely legal draftee to be taken in one of the last picks in the draft, he has so far exceeded most peoples expectations at this very early stage of his career.
That would be true if you're talking about non-Carlton people.

IIRC, Scott Lucas opined that he relies on footy smarts to find free space.  In other words, he's like Lance Whitnall without the weight rather than a Levi Casboult.  His leading patterns will therefore be a bit more convoluted and it'll take his team mates a while to adjust.  He's only 191 cm and AFAIK isn't a huge leaper, so we wouldn't want to see him attempting too many pack marks.  With his genes and the coaching his old man has given him, he should be a brilliant one-on-one mark when he puts on weight.

Gutted for Ciaran Byrne.  His impact as a rebounding defender has been immense.  If he does have to have a traditional reco, I hope homesickness won't become irresistible.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #50 –
Anyone have any inside knowledge on Byrne?

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #51 –
God awful game, really highlights the need for some class in the midfield. Gibbs was being clung to all the time, Cripps seems to want to do the fancy stuff more than the meat and potatoes. Curnow tries his guts out and should win our best and fairest this season but he is not the skilled mid. We looked slow and clumsy.

Down back, where would we be without Simmo, he was outstanding last night, in fact while I said Curnow should take out the B&F, I might strike that and name Kade. Docherty is being sat on a bit more,but when he can straight line a ball he looks outstanding. Weitering looks to be hitting the rookie wall, not as sure handed as he was at the start of the season. Plowman looked slow and reactive last night, I want him to be better and hopefully he can get an uninterrupted pre-season.

Kerridge, Sumner, Everitt, Walker very ordinary all round. Thomas and Wright decent but nothing special. Casboult - blah, Kruezer - yawn and Philips decent. They all seem to want to fly at the same ball, there is no forward structure, no separation, no football IQ.

This brings me to young Jack Silvagni, I don't understand the negative comments. This is a young kid, who would struggle to weigh 80Kgs wringing wet. He threw himself at the ball, found space in a forward line when no one else could. Gave a couple of nice handballs to advantage, was one of the few that could kick to advantage of his team mates and jumped in and flew that flag for Simmo I think. I'm sure he ran around a bit lost and he must kick those goals inside 30m, but as far as debuts go it was a good place to start.

No Murphy, No Armfield made an average speed side look very slow indeed, now Byrne is gone, we'll look slower again.    

If this match showed us anything it's that we're settling to where we should be bottom 4-6, we need skill and pace and we are rebuilding.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #52 –
Quote from: PaulP – on
We are 14 games into a 66 game rebuild, and last night, that's exactly how we looked - a side that's about 21 % complete.

Indeed, we have to keep reminding ourselves of this!
Reality always wins in the end.
 

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #53 –
A good indicator of our spirit is how we stand the mark. When we were on the boil not long ago we were doing that Hawthorn half step extra and showing some real desire. Last night it was the old hang back and fall asleep routine.

I wonder if we're doing the same amount of talking on the field that even opposition payers commented on not long ago. I'm thinking not.

We've found out how valuable Murf is now that he hasn't been there for an extended period. When he did his shoulder we had Judd but now there is no one to fill the hole to add that extra spark.

Jack is going to be something special. It was a pleasure to watch him last night and be reminded of his ol man. He's got poise and style, we'll just have to wait patiently until he fills out, like a good wine.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #54 –
An all round underwhelming night at the footy. Was pretty distracted by the election results flowing in, so the standard of the game made it easy to turn away at times.

My old man remarked that he has now seen three generations of Silvagnis make their debut. SoJ was fine, he has the makings of an agile half forward flanker that knows how to find space. He is a long way off regular senior footy, but there were good signs.

As for the rest, we mostly stunk it up, against a side that stunk just a little less.

The usual duds have been covered: everitt and casboult are not much good and neither is going to get any better. They will be turned over in the next couple of years, and we must pray that c curnow and mckay develop into the key forwards we need.

We miss murphy badly at the moment; his clean hands mean a second posession after a clearence is more likely to be to advantage. Kerridge and Curnow cannot do this, so fumbles were had all round.

Very disappointed for byrne. He is one of the few pacy players we have. With our lack of leg spead we are more reliant on clean disposal and good decision making.

Thought phillips played a good game and got around the ground well. He showed plenty of fight too. Two ruckmen is the best option for the style of footy played now. Kruezer started well taking two strong marks in the first quarter but faded. Perhaps it is under instruction, but he often got close to casboult when our defenders were kicking down the lines, forming a pack. With our weak midfield, the ball could be cleared and sent back. Providing more of a midfield option may be better, but he aint quick.

Our best were again simpson, docherty, and gibbs who battled hard against a tag.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #55 –
Jack is very smart player for an 18 year old.. a few more games and a pre season under his belt will do him the world of good getting confidence to take on more responsibility.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #56 –
Quote from: Raydan – on

Kerridge, Sumner, Everitt, Walker very ordinary all round. Thomas and Wright decent but nothing special. Casboult - blah, Kruezer - yawn and Philips decent. They all seem to want to fly at the same ball, there is no forward structure, no separation, no football IQ.



Agree not good enough and we need better players.

But we still have a weak group of youngsters coming through so we need to keep going to the draft.

Having said that.....when Charlie and McKay are fit they should play

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #57 –
Quote from: Mav – on
That would be true if you're talking about non-Carlton people.

IIRC, Scott Lucas opined that he relies on footy smarts to find free space.  In other words, he's like Lance Whitnall without the weight rather than a Levi Casboult.  His leading patterns will therefore be a bit more convoluted and it'll take his team mates a while to adjust.  He's only 191 cm and AFAIK isn't a huge leaper, so we wouldn't want to see him attempting too many pack marks.  With his genes and the coaching his old man has given him, he should be a brilliant one-on-one mark when he puts on weight.

Gutted for Ciaran Byrne.  His impact as a rebounding defender has been immense.  If he does have to have a traditional reco, I hope homesickness won't become irresistible.

If Jack can turn into a player as effective as Lance Whitnall, i'll take that every day of the week. I doubt he'll be plagued by the same kind of problems as lance, knee/weight issues. In this modern age, finding a footballer who can use his brain to get the ball is somewhat rare.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #58 –
Quote from: bratblue – on

We've found out how valuable Murf is now that he hasn't been there for an extended period.

Murph was a key factor in our winning run because of his leadership, his run and particularly his disposal skills.

Re: Rd 15: Post Game ________: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #59 –
Quote from: Robblues – on
Anyone have any inside knowledge on Byrne?

No - but Bolton looked pretty concerned, and the talk around the traps is ACL. Obviously, we hope it doesn't come to that.