The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

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Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #90 – July 12, 2013, 12:36:49 pm

It was interesting the Trott decision with many people labelling it 'poor' but based upon what?

The 'poor' part was the fact one of their key pieces of technology wasn't ready for the ball!

When the decision was referred it fell to the 3rd umpire to decide if the standing umpire (Dar in this case) had gotten it wrong. Based upon the evidence how could you not give it out? Did he hit the ball? - if you're not sure then the benefit should have gone to the batsman particularly with the LBW law. The technology not being available probably must have put the decision into some doubt however the front on hot spot showed nothing, the replay seemed to indicate it was pad first and then (and this is the big thing for me) that 'snicko' technology picked up nothing before the pad AND the bat was some way out in front by that stage.

Based upon that and the fact that ball pitched and but for the fact it intercepted the batsman AND he had not hit the ball it would have gone on to hit the stumps (clearly is what I look for). You must be certain.

I have no doubt Trott felt he hit it but the evidence did not show that. The question therefore is: Was there enough evidence to overturn the standing umpires decision (you have to be sure)?. When we say "OUT" the batsman in our mind is clearly out - we are sure. When we say "NOT OUT" we are not sure and that can be for any number of reasons.

An awful lot of time was taken up with that decision so I would love to know what else took place in that process - did the 3rd umpire speak with the standing umpire? I noted that 'snicko' wasn't included in the review package of replays initially so the question remains was it looked at as well during or afterwards.

All very interesting. If you have a look at the footage 'live' with no replay and once only what would your decision have been? OUT or NOT OUT?

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #91 – July 12, 2013, 03:42:51 pm

Quote from: spf – on July 12, 2013, 12:36:49 pm

It was interesting the Trott decision with many people labelling it 'poor' but based upon what?

The 'poor' part was the fact one of their key pieces of technology wasn't ready for the ball!

When the decision was referred it fell to the 3rd umpire to decide if the standing umpire (Dar in this case) had gotten it wrong. Based upon the evidence how could you not give it out? Did he hit the ball? - if you're not sure then the benefit should have gone to the batsman particularly with the LBW law. The technology not being available probably must have put the decision into some doubt however the front on hot spot showed nothing, the replay seemed to indicate it was pad first and then (and this is the big thing for me) that 'snicko' technology picked up nothing before the pad AND the bat was some way out in front by that stage.

Based upon that and the fact that ball pitched and but for the fact it intercepted the batsman AND he had not hit the ball it would have gone on to hit the stumps (clearly is what I look for). You must be certain.

I have no doubt Trott felt he hit it but the evidence did not show that. The question therefore is: Was there enough evidence to overturn the standing umpires decision (you have to be sure)?. When we say "OUT" the batsman in our mind is clearly out - we are sure. When we say "NOT OUT" we are not sure and that can be for any number of reasons.

An awful lot of time was taken up with that decision so I would love to know what else took place in that process - did the 3rd umpire speak with the standing umpire? I noted that 'snicko' wasn't included in the review package of replays initially so the question remains was it looked at as well during or afterwards.

All very interesting. If you have a look at the footage 'live' with no replay and once only what would your decision have been? OUT or NOT OUT?

I agree with what you have posted. It is very unfortunate that the square-leg hot-spot wasn't ready for that delivery, as that would have given a definitive answer. When i watched it live i thought it was pretty plum, but that was probably due to my bias.

Correct me if i am wrong, but as i recall, one of the commentators said that Aleem Dar (field ump) suggested that it hit pad first, but he wasn't sure about whether it was hitting the stumps or something (i was half asleep). So when the third umpire told him it was hitting middle and leg, he gave it out.
In the AFL it would have been umpire's call because IMO that vision was inconclusive.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #92 – July 12, 2013, 03:49:26 pm

Out!!

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #93 – July 12, 2013, 07:34:20 pm

100% Raydan- Haddin's (non-) shot stank. Far too often he ends up being involved in these collapses - and not in a good way.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #94 – July 12, 2013, 09:06:20 pm

Peterson down. Glad to see that, He can be a pain in the @rse for us.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #95 – July 12, 2013, 09:35:00 pm

Cook gone...wicket to Agar....well done young fella......
Keep the pressure up aussies...Poms on the ropes...

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #96 – July 13, 2013, 12:06:13 am

Clarke blinked and took the new ball.

Turning point.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #97 – July 13, 2013, 12:09:49 am

Clarke is bowling Pattinson, Siddle & Starc into the ground, with back-up from Watson & Agar in very short spells, you have to wonder if we are a bowler short in this match.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #98 – July 13, 2013, 12:14:48 am

Poms are 153 in front with 5 wickets still in hand, we need a wicket urgently ......

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #99 – July 13, 2013, 12:16:35 am

Quote from: TheSheik – on July 13, 2013, 12:14:48 am

Poms are 153 in front with 5 wickets still in hand, we need a wicket urgently ......

I asked for it and Siddle delivered, Prior was looking dangerous too.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #100 – July 13, 2013, 12:16:58 am

Quote from: TheSheik – on July 13, 2013, 12:09:49 am

Clarke is bowling Pattinson, Siddle & Starc into the ground, with back-up from Watson & Agar in very short spells, you have to wonder if we are a bowler short in this match.

The problem is the same as it has been for a while, our bowlers don't get a rest because the batsmen don't hang around. This is three days in a row our guy have bowled again.

Not a million overs but you never want to bowl more than two in a row.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #101 – July 13, 2013, 07:14:50 am

Quote from: cimm1979 – on July 13, 2013, 12:06:13 am

Clarke blinked and took the new ball.

Turning point.

Yes agree. Wasn't a good decision, played to what he's used to rather than the conditions.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #102 – July 13, 2013, 07:20:43 am

More controversy from England with THAT edge from Broad to slip. Broad stood his ground and Aleem Dar gave it not out.

All the media is going on about Broad should have walked etc and the obvious decision - the bit that hasn't been brought up enough was the moronic decision to refer the Ian Bell LBW decision when Watson was bowling to a ball that was clearly missing leg and Haddin knew it! Why did Clarke do it?

If that had not happened the Broad situation could have been referred and he would have been out. Crucial and tide turning moment.

England in front now and I think 261 is already too many for Australia.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #103 – July 13, 2013, 07:35:17 am

Excellent quote from Glenn McGrath:

"DRS was brought in to correct obviously wrong decisions and that is how captains should use it. Alastair Cook does just that, he is very sparing with it, and hopefully Michael Clarke does the same after this. To me, it has to be the umpire [fault]. A player is allowed to stand his ground. If Australia had one appeal left, Broad would have walked. The fact there was no referral left, he left it up to the umpire." - Glenn McGrath

Michael Clarke take note.

Re: The Ashes - First Test @ Trent Bridge

Reply #104 – July 13, 2013, 08:27:44 am

We have played quite well in this Test but being unable to remove Bell & Broad will see us go 1-0 down in the series now.