Carlton Supporters Club

You know, I really can't figure out which one of us is the bigger idiot - you, for your seemingly non existent comprehension skills, or me for falling for your sh1t time and time gain. In all honesty, it's probably me.

My position is as blunt and clear as can possibly be - if you vote no, you're wrong. How exactly is this Machiavellian ?

In regard to your second question, don't be a smart ar$e.

And there it is, when was it I bullied you PaulP?

Herein lies the issue.

Irrespective of whether or not you agree, one side is not "right", and the other is not "wrong".

They are ideological differences and remind me very much of the capitalist vs communist debate.

It isn't validated by a vote majority either, because the only thing that matters is how an individual views the world and society.

People can assert that their position is right, but as far as I am aware, that doesnt make anyone more correct.

Hitler thought he was right, and so did much of his nation.  Look how THAT turned out.

Are you on drugs ?

Thry, I'm actually a "yes" voter.

But that vote and the vote of others has to come for the right reasons not because of being guilted or bullied into it!

If people vote for the wrong reason, things will become very bad because they don't really believe it!

I also think people have the right vote anyway they choose, which seems to grate some.

LP, I don't really care which way you want to vote.

I have a different scenario for an outcome that I am much happier with.

I will be filling out my form ticking zero boxes and sending it back to our government.

The reason:  To make a statement.  Initially I was going to vote No, and then I swung around to Yes, and of late I have decided that this is a tiresome debate, and a message needs to be sent to our leadership that will actually have an impact.

Why??

Voting No achieves nothing. The status quo will remain, and the push for SSM will rage for the rest of my lifetime.  I personally believe we have much bigger issues that we need to be concerned about than whether or not this community can get married.

This made me start to think about voting Yes.  Get it over and done with, but I don't like the way this has gone.  Particularly the backlash towards Carlton for remaining Switzerland on the debate and being attacked for it.

I have decided the best way for me to make a statement on the issue, is to vote nothing.  I will send back my form blank, so I can make a statement that is more in line with where I sit on this subject, and that is for our government to make that decision so we can get on with it.  If they see fit to change legislation do so, but ensure that people's ideologies are protected.

Hawthorn Football Club embraces and welcomes all people, regardless of race, religion, gender, sexuality or cultural background.

The club celebrates diversity and demands equality, and also respects the rights of individuals to make their own personal choices and form their own opinions.

Hawthorn sees its role as providing an environment of respect, diversity and inclusivity where people can embrace their differences and unite in their love of the club and the game of AFL.  

Feel free to answer the original question!

Hawthorn's statement, where is the outrage???

“A club by coming out is saying this is the view we think all our members should have, and not even political parties are making that decision,” Koch said on Sunrise.

“(The process) should be, OK do you represent all your stakeholders and are you meant to be representing them in something like this — you’re a footy club.”

sure, I'll answer.

I don't think you will, you seem too emotionally invested to make a objective assessment.

I'm a man of my word.

I've been on this forum and its predecessor for over a decade, and in that time, you are the only one who misconstrues what i say. This isn't the first time it's happened. It's happened several times before. I strive for clarity and economy of expression with everything I type. Whether I get there is another matter. And out of the dozens and dozens of regular posters we've had over that time, only you seem to constantly twist what i say into something it isn't. Why is that do you think ?