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Topic: 2018 - What do you expect from the club? (Read 65502 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #210 –
Paul, the well that never runs dry is a healthier place than the slough of despond!  ;)
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #211 –
Quote from: cookie2 – on
Paul, the well that never runs dry is a healthier place than the slough of despond!  ;)

cookie, I've never heard that one, but I like it. Will have to commit it to memory.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #212 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
It would be great if all those players became guns but the reality is we will be doing well if half of them do.

Agreed, but if even 50% or more approach that level, then we'll have a dynasty on our hands.

Especially given we'll add Wines and/or Kelly in the next 1-2 years....  ;)
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #213 –
It's all well and good to dream, but this is all pie in the sky stuff. The % of AFL/VFL listed players who play 100 or more games is small. I don't remember the number, but I think it's between 5 and 10%. That's basically 5 seasons on an AFL list, give or take for injuries, finals, suspensions. form, etc.

To have half of those named get to that point would an incredible historical anomaly.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #214 –
Have to agree with flyboy and cookie. Looking forward with more hope than usual. For me ladder position is not the point - improved competitiveness, and visible player development is.

1. This year the blow-outs were fewer and smaller - even at the end of the season.

2. The number of young players _contributing_ at AFL level is so much better than in the pre-BB days.

3. The hit rate on players _contributing_ after coming from other clubs is easily better than pre-SOS, but also appears to be better than the hit rate for drafted players - a new, welcome net positive.

4. For #2 and #3 to be happening we now have to have a more than functional recruiting and development.

5. No sign of any "fat head" rumblings getting any traction at PP - at all. Communications are low key professional and positive. The change of CEO could have been handled better, but no organisation gets everything right.

So I am looking forward to watching the individual players develop and function as a team even better this season. In past seasons hopes were focused on one or two players making a difference - big surprise it did not.

Now with a whole crew of new and young players who have already shown "baby steps up", this season looks like a positive experience as a supporter, despite loosing Gibbs and Docherty, but may not see much change in the ladder position.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #215 –
Quote from: PaulP – on
It's all well and good to dream, but this is all pie in the sky stuff. The % of AFL/VFL listed players who play 100 or more games is small. I don't remember the number, but I think it's between 5 and 10%. That's basically 5 seasons on an AFL list, give or take for injuries, finals, suspensions. form, etc.

To have half of those named get to that point would an incredible historical anomaly.

No, I disagree, the stats clearly show that higher draft picks - on average - have significantly longer - and better - careers than the lower/rookie picks...

most of those blokes have already shown they can cut it at AFL senior level and have an influence - they're not exactly Nick Graham types!
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #216 –
Quote from: flyboy77 – on
No, I disagree, the stats clearly show that higher draft picks - on average - have significantly longer - and better - careers than the lower/rookie picks...

most of those blokes have already shown they can cut it at AFL senior level and have an influence - they're not exactly Nick Graham types!

You're right about the 1st rounders, but I still think expecting half of them to play 100 or more games in unrealistic.

One of the differences between you and I is that you seem to come to conclusions about players much quicker than me. I would need to see at least 1 more season of the guys from previous drafts to see if they can endure. Plenty of players have flash-in-the-pan good games. Doing that consistently, year in year out, is much harder.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #217 –
Quote from: PaulP – on
You're right about the 1st rounders, but I still think expecting half of them to play 100 or more games in unrealistic.

One of the differences between you and I is that you seem to come to conclusions about players much quicker than me. I would need to see at least 1 more season of the guys from previous drafts to see if they can endure. Plenty of players have flash-in-the-pan good games. Doing that consistently, year in year out, is much harder.
Paul as you would have heard ad nauseam, one of the things SOS is looking for in players is character. I dont see flash in the pan from the young blokes we have drafted under SOS/Bolts, I see blokes who can endure who will only get better as they play more games together. Having said that, I respect the fact you need more time and see more to be convinced.
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #218 –
Quote from: Gointocarlton – on
Paul as you would have heard ad nauseam, one of the things SOS is looking for in players is character. I dont see flash in the pan from the young blokes we have drafted under SOS/Bolts, I see blokes who can endure who will only get better as they play more games together. Having said that, I respect the fact you need more time and see more to be convinced.

I guess when I said flash in the pan, I meant showing moments of class or brilliance, or a consistency of good skill level / good decision making. The sort of qualities that win matches. I wasn't really referring to grit or fight or ticker. The players this year showed plenty of these last 3 qualities, I don't deny that.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #219 –
Call me sceptical but I am still to be convinced that SPS will be 100 game, high output player, or that Jack Silvagni will be in our best 22 in 18 months, or that Zac Fisher can match his determination with consistent impact games, or that David Cunningham will reward the faith that SOS showed in him at the draft table.

They all might hit the mark and be A or B Graders but as it stands at the moment, it is developing potential that they offer.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #220 –
Quote from: townsendcalling – on
Call me sceptical but I am still to be convinced that SPS will be 100 game, high output player, or that Jack Silvagni will be in our best 22 in 18 months, or that Zac Fisher can match his determination with consistent impact games, or that David Cunningham will reward the faith that SOS showed in him at the draft table.

They all might hit the mark and be A or B Graders but as it stands at the moment, it is developing potential that they offer.
Fair enough I guess. Personally, when I look at SPS highlights, I think "magic". He does stuff that is Rioli or Betts like. I even see glimpses of McLeod (who I personally rate along with the late Maurice Rioli as the 2 best indigenous players I have watched play the game).
SOS brings a passion that stems for a genuine love for the club, something you cant train or teach. He will be a beauty when he grows up, its in the genes.
Little Zac and Cunners I am also not sure about but am prepared to give them time, especially Zac. He has some zip, mongrel and beautiful left foot.
Ill say one thing about Cunners, I think he lacks confidence. He doesnt seem to think he belongs, Polson seems the same to me. That can be rectified by the coaching group (see Liam Jones). I think they have the tools to make it.
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #221 –
Just on Cam Polson, he kind of reminds me of a young Marc Murphy in the way he runs at times. Hope he can get a sustained run at it for Northern, because he could turn out to be a player. Like a lot of these guys, they just need time to build their confidence.

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #222 –
Quote from: spf – on
Just on Cam Polson, he kind of reminds me of a young Marc Murphy in the way he runs at times. Hope he can get a sustained run at it for Northern, because he could turn out to be a player. Like a lot of these guys, they just need time to build their confidence.

Agreed, he already seems to show more than the likes of Graham or Lamb at the same stage of their career. Looks smart, I suppose the question remains about his durability at AFL level, but if he gets things right he could be a 200 game player.

Our next Wright!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #223 –
Watch a tape of our win vs Hawks last year, Fisher cut Hawthorn up.  Still needs 10 kg, gym should be his main residence for this preseason.
DrE is no more... you ok with that harmonica man?
 

Re: 2018 - What do you expect from the club?

Reply #224 –
Quote from: Professer E – on
Watch a tape of our win vs Hawks last year, Fisher cut Hawthorn up.  Still needs 10 kg, gym should be his main residence for this preseason.

Interestingly, from possibly our best win of the year, the 3 highest ranked Super Coach players were Docherty, Boekhorst and Gibbs!!! ,