2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

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Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #45 – July 14, 2018, 08:08:55 am

We would be the most skilled and consistent side in the comp at giving the ball back to the opposition in their 50. Twice we were pinged for stepping over the line when kicking out.

Once Daisy had to come from behind to punch as someone kicked backwards badly.

At least once they marked a kick that was going across the ground from us in their 50.

There was at least once where we stuffed up under minimal pressure, they picked it up we tackle, they throw the ball to team mste then goal.

Any danger of a team rule that unless a defender is 200 metres in the vlear we don't kick backwards or sideways in our defensive 50. These easy goals we give away every week are demoralising.

I haven't read Kruds thread about rule changes, but any chance of: If a player has the footy and they have a chance to get rid of it and they don't kick or handball it correctly then a free is paid. I would prefer lots of frees and the rules applied correctly, to random allocation of them.

It was curious to see Centre bounce set up of basically everyone in a straight line down the ground - all players essentially down the spine - would that have been us or them instigating this.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #46 – July 14, 2018, 08:13:48 am

Many of us are very disappointed with the season. Finger pointing at some area is not valid, it's across the board in some cases, but the key is the amount of injuries, with lack continuity especially with such an inexperienced list, and loss of key personal Gibbs, Murphy, Doc, etc confidence wanes, it's a tough task. That's not to say some decisions made by the MC at time make sense , but you can only play who you have left. It's re group time as best we can, season of ours is long over, not from a wins point of view, but player experimentation as well, it's now just survival till seasons end

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #47 – July 14, 2018, 08:52:12 am

Quote from: Inboltswetrust – on July 14, 2018, 01:06:03 am

We need to look around for the best available at the seasons end- install Barker/Teague now. I would sound out Bevo

Great idea, the Doggies blokes love him dont they

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #48 – July 14, 2018, 09:00:02 am

Quote from: hanwell – on July 13, 2018, 11:57:21 pm

Firstly Laj, unless you are are mind reader you don't know what I think, and if you are you are no good.

Richmond, Geelong, and Collingwood all faced down the doubters and two of them by sticking with the coach and plan won flags, Collingwood this year in my obviously flawed opinion are probably the only team that can challenge Richmond,

What is our history this century? Bring in (or back in the case of Parko) an "old coach", use him up then sack him for an untried one, three times for zero stability and sustainability

So according to your plan lets do it one more time for the likes of, who? Lyon? Roos?

Or adopt those other successful clubs, stick fat (to coin a Sticks phrase) and see what happens. We dont do that and all we are doing is feeding the chooks and endorsing the sad fact that we are a reactionary club that is lead by other's opinions..
Northern, my "gripe" as you put it was more about that the players we lost in the first quarter were both crucial to the entire structure for both games, Martin is good enough again to be All Australian this year, so we played two ruckmen to curtail his influence, the "fit"one goes down early, robbing us of the option of an extra tall forward so Kreuser has to ruck all day. This week he goes down, with no back up as we brought in an untried young player who is a forward, not a back up ruckman, Some will say its madness at the MC but my take is that we are running out of players. Kreuser goes down early (by the way only back one game since being injured!!! My point!!!), game over.

So lets sack the coach as usual.

Sorry mate, but even when they were struggling they were still winning games. Comparisons with our club/BB and other clubs/coaches is erroneous. Like comparing fish with turnips. We've turned the clock of failure back to pre 2000s and the 'Roys etc. And this is not about sacking the coach, much, much bigger than that... this is about the President, SOS, head of footy and the coach. In case you haven't noticed, we've been reduced to beeing the worst club in the AFL and are now a laughing stock and the subject of ridicule.

And, for the record, there are clubs in the 8 with long injury lists, injuries to experienced blokes as well.

Our problems go far deeper than losing a ruckman early in a game and not having Doc for the season. Far deeper.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #49 – July 14, 2018, 09:01:16 am

Quote from: Brettie – on July 14, 2018, 12:18:09 am

Good news is we didn’t have a goalless quarter this week ?

You've been drinking Boltons cool aid.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #50 – July 14, 2018, 09:23:50 am

I am getting a little tired of the condescending presumptive attitude that dominates some of the posters here, assuming that I am enjoying this distressing mess, advocating failure, not "understanding" our predicament and how we just keep going back to the well when it gets tough.

Mate we have been the media's punching bag for a decade, because of the inbreed arrogance that people like yourself demonstrate on a daily basis, that's why all the other clubs despise Carlton, we were so successful for so long, and it was based upon a fraud. And now when finally the administration wakes up to the real world, and realise that there are no more quick fixes, and that the previous administrators (I actually blame Collins and his self serving) had no idea, that we are a complete basket case who have not learnt a thing from our sins of the past, and your response is to sack the coach again.

And if another person reminds me of how he teams I mentioned are not comparable "I'll spew", its not about games won, or ladder positions, its about decisions. None of the teams, including the Dogs, were undergoing a reconstruction, they were resets. Unfortunately our team has chosen to go down a much deeper and harder option all I want is it to be given a chance to play out, what have we got to loose it's too late to top up....

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #51 – July 14, 2018, 09:31:40 am

Quote from: dodge – on July 14, 2018, 08:08:55 am

We would be the most skilled and consistent side in the comp at giving the ball back to the opposition in their 50. Twice we were pinged for stepping over the line when kicking out.

Once Daisy had to come from behind to punch as someone kicked backwards badly.

At least once they marked a kick that was going across the ground from us in their 50.

There was at least once where we stuffed up under minimal pressure, they picked it up we tackle, they throw the ball to team mste then goal.

Any danger of a team rule that unless a defender is 200 metres in the vlear we don't kick backwards or sideways in our defensive 50. These easy goals we give away every week are demoralising.

I haven't read Kruds thread about rule changes, but any chance of: If a player has the footy and they have a chance to get rid of it and they don't kick or handball it correctly then a free is paid. I would prefer lots of frees and the rules applied correctly, to random allocation of them.

It was curious to see Centre bounce set up of basically everyone in a straight line down the ground - all players essentially down the spine - would that have been us or them instigating this.

Completely agree on our backline ball movement. I think that this, along with zone defence, is all part of the disastrous game plan we have adopted that is leading us nowhere. Our players don't/can't take the game on because every time we get the ball at half back instead of running hard forward our half backs drop back to switch play. Its hard to initiate an attack when nearly one quarter of you players drop back and leave the opposition to casually set up their defensive lines. The few times we've looked good this year is when players run together and try to move through the middle.

But what usually happens instead is we either turn it over while slowly switching play or give up and just kick long down the line to a contest - one where the opposition usually has the numbers because most of our guys stayed back behind play. (yet somehow seem out numbered when the opposition rebound quickly?)

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #52 – July 14, 2018, 09:40:25 am

Quote from: hanwell – on July 14, 2018, 09:23:50 am

I am getting a little tired of the condescending presumptive attitude that dominates some of the posters here, assuming that I am enjoying this distressing mess, advocating failure, not "understanding" our predicament and how we just keep going back to the well when it gets tough.

Mate we have been the media's punching bag for a decade, because of the inbreed arrogance that people like yourself demonstrate on a daily basis, that's why all the other clubs despise Carlton, we were so successful for so long, and it was based upon a fraud. And now when finally the administration wakes up to the real world, and realise that there are no more quick fixes, and that the previous administrators (I actually blame Collins and his self serving) had no idea, that we are a complete basket case who have not learnt a thing from our sins of the past, and your response is to sack the coach again.

And if another person reminds me of how he teams I mentioned are not comparable "I'll spew", its not about games won, or ladder positions, its about decisions. None of the teams, including the Dogs, were undergoing a reconstruction, they were resets. Unfortunately our team has chosen to go down a much deeper and harder option all I want is it to be given a chance to play out, what have we got to loose it's too late to top up....

Those sides, Richmond, Geelong, are not comparable. Don't need to be Einstein to work that out. Their situation was very different as finalists for a few years. We're on one win. So start spewing.

One side.that is more comparable is the Bulldogs. Below us in 2014, change coach, premiers 2 years later. While you give us stupid comparison I'll find a more comparable one.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #53 – July 14, 2018, 09:55:19 am

Not remotely interested in anything you have to say, be sure not to miss your plane buddy

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #54 – July 14, 2018, 10:01:23 am

I really wish I could be positive, but I can't. Not based on what I saw last night.
At the moment we are not just a club in crisis, but a club in search of an identity.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #55 – July 14, 2018, 10:28:58 am

Quote from: hanwell – on July 14, 2018, 09:55:19 am

Not remotely interested in anything you have to say, be sure not to miss your plane buddy

That's ok, i don't listen to people that have no idea either as it makes you less intelligent. Imagine comparing Richmond and Geelong to our one win situation then get the sooks when the obviously error is pointed out. I'll point out the GHogs and Port under Primus to Hinckley. Laughable poster. Enjoy your losses.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #56 – July 14, 2018, 10:35:50 am

I guess these type of results causes people to react in different ways, but the arrogance of a few posters on these forums makes my eyes bleed and makes me remember why I left for a period of time. The way we treat others is a measure of person you really are.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #57 – July 14, 2018, 10:41:51 am

Look, people: it is like this. We are experiencing the worst period in our cub's history. We can't do anything about it at the moment. But the moment we turn on each other, whether we agree or not, is the moment we BECOME the sort of crap we are trying not to be.

"Victory has many fathers, but defeat is an orphan." Think on this.
"Disunity is death!" Try this one, too.

If we cannot hold it together, then maybe we deserve what is happening to us.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #58 – July 14, 2018, 10:46:02 am

Quote from: hanwell – on July 14, 2018, 09:55:19 am

Not remotely interested in anything you have to say, be sure not to miss your plane buddy

For what it's worth I agree with you.
Sacking the coach might give us a temporary sugar hit but ultimately it would lead to our ruin.
Most supporters underestimated the dire state of our list, brought about by decades of negligence and poor management, there's simply no easy options.
The harsh reality is that it might be 6 or 8 years until it reaches fruition, until Curnow, Weitering, Dow, O'Brien, SPS, McKay and the likes are old enough and experienced enough to form a quality core which we've lacked since the 1990's.
The hard work is all ahead of us, and one of the hardest things we have to do is to convince the young players that their day will come if they stick.
Sack the coach now and it all unravels.

Re: 2018 Rd 16: Post Game Passion: Carlton vs St Kilda

Reply #59 – July 14, 2018, 10:46:09 am

It is exactly the same reason I left this place before, then it was a key board bully maned Pass It To Carrots, this particular bully is fixated upon some perceived uninformed notion that I actually am enjoying this current debacle. Mods I find his behaviour insulting and if you are concerned about loosing posters and members then look at the arrogance of this particular buffoon. He will now typically respond and throw some more insults.