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Topic: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast (Read 30152 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #45 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
Sinclair was BOG, had 3 brownlow votes in the previous game vs the Swans....Kreuzer was his opponent...

I’m not sure what the umpires were on, but I’d like some  :)

Sinclair got a couple of easy goals but Kreuzer towelled him up in the ruck (37 hitouts to 26) and was equally effective around the ground.  I guess Sinclair got the votes because the Swans midfield was well on top.
It's still the Gulf of Mexico, Don Old!

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #47 –
Quote from: DJC – on
I’m not sure what the umpires were on, but I’d like some  :)

Sinclair got a couple of easy goals but Kreuzer towelled him up in the ruck (37 hitouts to 26) and was equally effective around the ground.  I guess Sinclair got the votes because the Swans midfield was well on top.

Ignore the tap stats they are meaningless, I haven't looked but if you add a layer of complexity and look at taps to advantage they can be more meaningful.

The other stat worth looking at is direct scores from center clearances, and how much involvement each ruck had in that chain of events. In 2019 under the new rules this stat is really telling the story of games! In 2019 something like 40% of scores come from center breaks, when historically it's been just 10%.

We would expect SpecialK to better Sinclair around the ground, but in recent times Sinclair's 2nd and 3rd efforts have greatly improved.

Is it a coincidence Sinclair is coached by a former ruck option?

Is it a further coincidence Liam Jones had such sterling VFL form when being coached by Fraser?

Is it also a coincidence Nankervis came out of the Longmire managed system?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #48 –
who's our ruck coach? Hamish....?
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #49 –
Quote from: flyboy77 – on
who's our ruck coach? Hamish....?

Correct Hamish McIntosh, but we also have Fraser and Rocca on staff.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #51 –
Preuss hasn't a fired a shot yet, he could be anything but it's only a 50/50 proposition!

Really what fans want is a now proposition, and I'm not sure Preuss is that at all!

Long term, De Koning and McKay might well have him covered, but that is a long term issue.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #52 –
On the ruck question, I'm not sure why it's considered such an issue for this game. Witts will probably have more hitouts than anyone we put against him, but we are consistently strong on the clearance front (both in the centre and at stoppages) and I expect we'll have them covered there. Am I missing something here?

So, we'll get more clearances, but the issue is about what actually constitutes "clearing" the ball for us. Our delivery forward has been extremely poor and that's nothing to do with who is rucking. We either bomb it in, or poorly attempt to execute more precise delivery.

2 problems with this. First, whilst Harry has done extremely well, given the few clean deliveries he gets, to mark and put himself in a position to goal, we're not going to kick enough through him and we're presently light-on for other tall options who can mark and kick straight (looking at you Levi).

Second, we are not giving ourselves the opportunity to score the other way - by locking it in F50 when the ball (more often than not) simply spills. If we let the GC half-backs just run it straight back out, as we did with McVeigh, Lloyd, Mills, Jones last week, we're going to struggle.

Not too worried about our defence. I think it's looking pretty good, TBH.

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #53 –
Quote from: DamonBlue – on
On the ruck question, I'm not sure why it's considered such an issue for this game. Witts will probably have more hitouts than anyone we put against him, but we are consistently strong on the clearance front (both in the centre and at stoppages) and I expect we'll have them covered there. Am I missing something here?

So, we'll get more clearances, but the issue is about what actually constitutes "clearing" the ball for us. Our delivery forward has been extremely poor and that's nothing to do with who is rucking. We either bomb it in, or poorly execute more precise delivery.

2 problems with this. First, whilst Harry has done extremely well, given the few clean deliveries he gets, to mark and put himself in a position to goal, we're not going to kick enough through him. Second, we are not giving ourselves the opportunity score the other way - by locking it in F50 when the ball (more often than not) simply spills. If we let the GC half-backs just run it straight back out, as we did with McVeigh, Lloyd, Mills, Jones last week, we're going to struggle.

Not too worried about our defence. I think it's looking pretty good, TBH.

x2, a nice summary of the situation.

The only thing I can add, is that even in losing the taps to Witts, good rucks will sway the balance of clearances with 2nd and 3rd efforts.

I have to wonder if our rucks have simply been told not to get in Cripps way, but I'm sure Cripps would appreciate a block or two from the ruckmen every now and then!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"
 

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #54 –
Quote from: LP – on
x2, a nice summary of the situation.

The only thing I can add, is that even in losing the taps to Witts, good rucks will sway the balance of clearances with 2nd and 3rd efforts.

I have to wonder if our rucks have simply been told not to get in Cripps way, but I'm sure Cripps would appreciate a block or two from the ruckmen every now and then!

Good point, LP. Kreuzer obviously the best option in that regard. Let's hope he gets up.

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #55 –
Quote from: DamonBlue – on
Good point, LP. Kreuzer obviously the best option in that regard. Let's hope he gets up.

We make excuses at times for our weak ruck options, Casboult was OK, McKay is just a kid, Phillips can't get a run at it.

For perspective have a think about Wayne Carey's comments on Ben Brown, note I don't think Carey is necessarily an oracle of these matters.

Now I suspect Brown has our forward pack well and truly covered, other than perhaps The Gov he'd be a clear win KPF for us as well as a useful 2nd ruck option. But Carey tore strips off Brown after last weekend claiming that Brown has never laid a tackle, and in spite of all Brown's good F50 efforts it's just not good enough by AFL standards to have no other aspect to his game!

What the feck is the excuse for our blokes?

They don't even have the F50 game to cover for he lack of other deficiencies, they should be working twice as hard around the ground!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #56 –
Unlike others, I don't see this as as some kind of "Bolton lives or dies" type match. I think it's 50/50. The two teams are even in terms of potential to win/lose.

Suns by 3 points.

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #57 –
Quote from: PaulP – on
Unlike others, I don't see this as as some kind of "Bolton lives or dies" type match. I think it's 50/50. The two teams are even in terms of potential to win/lose.

Suns by 3 points.

Yes, with SpecialK still out or even if they play him underdone, I think the good form of Witts coupled with 2MP will be hard for us to deal with.

Although I concede even when in bad form Weitering seemed to match up quite well on 2MP in the past.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Pre-Game Possibilities: AFL Rd 4: Carlton vs Gold Coast

Reply #59 –
SpecialK's best partial season came in 2011 when they over-cooked him in the VFL before letting him return against the Swans after the long break. I'd never before seen a Ruck/KPP have such an impact, it was like watching a 200cm Ablett Jnr run through AFL opponents like they were training tackle bags!

I realise that was a long time back in time, but it sort of indicates his mindset towards his footy.

Many of you will remember that game!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"