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Topic: The rise.... and RISE of Marc Pittonet (Read 95743 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #285 –
Quote from: LP – on
For the life of me I can't see how our already monolithic focus on the KPFs will somehow be improved by removing one leaving the other as the sole point of focus!

If we want one out SoJ might be the logical choice given the Filth have not much in ruck stocks at the moment, leave Harry and Charlie  as is, and Young, Harry and Cripps doing the zone work.

Our big problem this week is going to be the Filth's Mosquito fleet forward setup, not the KPPs.
Rumour is Darcy Cameron might be a shock selection this week...

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #286 –
Quote from: LP – on
For the life of me I can't see how our already monolithic focus on the KPFs will somehow be improved by removing one leaving the other as the sole point of focus!

If we want one out SoJ might be the logical choice given the Filth have not much in ruck stocks at the moment, leave Harry and Charlie  as is, and Young, Harry and Cripps doing the zone work.

Our big problem this week is going to be the Filth's Mosquito fleet forward setup, not the KPPs.

Aside from the West Coast game what we're doing just isn't working at the moment.
The forward line is dysfunctional and actually an asset to the opposition.
We need to do something different.
Maybe even something radical and unexpected
 e.g Swap Harry and Young,

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #287 –
Look, I get it, we are a bit unsure of whats happening and dropping a key forward wont help or what not, but have a look at how we lined up for what I fondly remember as the best days at the footy I have had in a very long time and this was against a side that played in the big dance last year.


Carlton 15.12.105 vs Sydney 13.9 87.

You know who didnt play?  Harry McKay.  You know who else was a notable absentee?  Marc Pittonet.

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/games/2022/031620220520.html

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #288 –
Quote from: Lods – on
Aside from the West Coast game what we're doing just isn't working at the moment.
The forward line is dysfunctional and actually an asset to the opposition.
We need to do something different.
Maybe even something radical and unexpected
 e.g Swap Harry and Young,

Yes like the thought.  The one thing that seems to be missing from Voss's coaching (so far) is his willingness to take risk.  In game radical position changes can get the team back firing sometimes.   
Ab   

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #289 –
In similar vein, on a day when Crippa is not effective (with half the opposition hanging off him), it would be interesting to see how he would go at CHB. 
Ab

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #290 –
Quote from: Lods – on
Aside from the West Coast game what we're doing just isn't working at the moment.
The forward line is dysfunctional and actually an asset to the opposition.
It's not Charlie and McKay that are the problem though, between them they'd kicked 18 goals over the 3 rounds before Wet Toast, 10-4-4, then 11 in the Wet Toast game, not sure fans can realistically expect more on average? :o

It's not the KPFs that are the problem, in those rounds from 4 through to 7 it was the absence of an effective small forward that hurt us, Owies was out Rnd 4 to 9 inclusive, Motlop and Durdin kept going with the status quo, but the lost goals of Owies were never covered!

It's a bit to easy to "remember" things differently to what they are, and come to a one size fits all conclusion that is actually wrong!

In any case, last weekend was the odd game out, we had all that dominance and couldn't score at all, when actually this season our scoring efficiency from F50s has been quite good but we just haven't been going in enough, too many unforced turnovers from the last kick approaching F50 has been the typical error.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #291 –
I wouldnt even count the West Coast game.....it probably did more harm than good and if we had a grinding 5 point win we might have got more out of it rather than doing it easy and giving everyone a false sense of where we are at...

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #292 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
I wouldnt even count the West Coast game.....it probably did more harm than good and if we had a grinding 5 point win we might have got more out of it rather than doing it easy and giving everyone a false sense of where we are at...
Yes, even so the three weeks before were 18 goals between the KPFs, can't expect more than that!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #293 –
Quote from: LP – on
We can find B-Grade ruck options, they are a dime a dozen, we already have and are using more than one at the moment, we got some in reserve, perhaps they are ranked C-Grade.

A-Grade KPFs are like a needle in a haystack. Why the feck would we want to feck up BigH's knees by exposing him to a bastardry of flogging him as ruck option against the likes of a Nankervis, Witts, Goldstein or Darcy?

Are we going to stupidly allow an elite KPP be smashed in the ruck, then complain about it after the fact like Scott has complained about Blicsavs being pulverised? Leave Scott sending his elite runner in for a bruising, it's good for every other club that happens, we do not have to follow that trend!

Leave our duds rucking and get our Mids effectively roving to the losing ruck, given how good some claim Pitto to be it seems our opposition find it easy to rove to their own losing ruck. Unless of course Pitto isn't quite as good as some claim! ;)

Only as a 2nd ruck. Haven't seen many rucks, pinch hitting rucks knees stuffed up. Harry's a big boy.

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #294 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
He's too fragile otherwise he would already be doing it.

He's a strong boy. Handle it like any other big forward having a run in the ruck. Plus a run around the ground, getting his hands on the ball very regularly would do him good, at least IMHO.

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #295 –
Quote from: LP – on
It's not Charlie and McKay that are the problem though, between them they'd kicked 18 goals over the 3 rounds before Wet Toast, 10-4-4, then 11 in the Wet Toast game, not sure fans can realistically expect more on average? :o

It's not the KPFs that are the problem, in those rounds from 4 through to 7 it was the absence of an effective small forward that hurt us, Owies was out Rnd 4 to 9 inclusive, Motlop and Durdin kept going with the status quo, but the lost goals of Owies were never covered!

It's a bit to easy to "remember" things differently to what they are, and come to a one size fits all conclusion that is actually wrong!

In any case, last weekend was the odd game out, we had all that dominance and couldn't score at all, when actually this season our scoring efficiency from F50s has been quite good but we just haven't been going in enough, too many unforced turnovers from the last kick approaching F50 has been the typical error.

I disagree LP.

1 goal 2 in a drawn match.  The 2 points regulation set shots from almost directly in front, and for some reason snapped for a behind.

Then you have the St. Kilda match.  1 goal 2 from 4 set shots for goal.  One of them hitting the middle of the ball and being a rain maker centering kick that didn't even make the distance.

6 touches for 1 goal against Brisbane.

Harry might have had 10 marks, with 2 of them inside 50 against the Bulldogs, but he has cost us 6 points with lazy kicking accuracy thus far on the premiership ladder table, and Im not sure that our defender and midfielders disposal efficiency is about them kicking it badly, or not getting many options to kick to, which is a symptom of key forwards not doing enough.  On one occasion on the weekend harry was trying to mark over the top of his opponent, rather than punching to spoil inside 50.  He took 2 marks for the game, inside 50.  Sure he got 10 marks, but we are playing this really crappy chip it short game style which is inflating our stats. 

On current form, Harry is on 12 goals from 9 games including an easy beat.  With poor conversion rate of about 50%.  If that continues, he is likely to end the season no about 30 goals.

Charlie is going ok and looks a match winner.  Harry is not having the same impact. 
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #296 –
Harry has also kicked some amazing deep pocket goals, for whatever reason, confidence, injury, he's off the boil, but that doesn't mean he isn't contributing.

For me, no Harry means Charlie always gets the top KPD, that isn't the case at the moment, because they rotate through the positions. It's a bit of fan naivety to think you can remove Harry and have no impact on Charlie.

I can't take it seriously, fans want someone to blame and they come up with the obvious because of it's appearance, but Charlie and SoJ have also missed pudding shots with conventional drop punts from 25m almost directly in front.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #297 –
Quote from: LP – on
Harry has also kicked some amazing deep pocket goals, for whatever reason, confidence, injury, he's off the boil, but that doesn't mean he isn't contributing.

For me, no Harry means Charlie always gets the top KPD, that isn't the case at the moment, because they rotate through the positions. It's a bit of fan naivety to think you can remove Harry and have no impact on Charlie.

I can't take it seriously, fans want someone to blame and they come up with the obvious because of it's appearance, but Charlie and SoJ have also missed pudding shots with conventional drop punts from 25m almost directly in front.
Tend to agree...dropping Harry is just going to heap more pressure on Charlie. I like the two tall forwards together and they are our ace in the pack. Its not like TDK has kicked a bag, Jack is kicking the ball about as reliably as Harry and that leaves Owies and Charlie to kick us a score as our mids give us nothing either.
Ours twos got knocked over by high school kids so I dont see any standout replacements for Harry from that lot...Im happy to play TDK this week and mix and match depending on how we are going and have some options but dropping Harry has a flow on effect that leaves us less potent and its odd we would do that in a game where the oppositions most glaring and only weakness is lack of size down back. We can win this game providing we dont do the old Carlton trick of picking the wrong team and beating ourselves...

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #298 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
We can win this game providing we dont do the old Carlton trick of picking the wrong team and beating ourselves...
If they pick Honey or Fisher this week, disappointing would be putting It mildly.
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #299 –
Quote from: Gointocarlton – on
If they pick Honey or Fisher this week, disappointing would be putting It mildly.
I think Fisher will be picked this week...Collingwood rotate so many through the middle I think Voss will want an army of mids to do the same and try and have some fresh legs in the last quarter.
Dont see Honey being picked but I reckon they will go with Martin hoping he can give us a quarter or two and hit the scoreboard.
He can go ok first up from a spell when his calves have had no work and are rested and its getting to desperation territory now and the Pies are ready to drop a game and might take us and Martin lightly so I can see the MC taking the punt.