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Topic: God help me - the Test Cricket thread (Read 874079 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #240 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
Thought the new kids Shardul and Natajaran swung the ball well for India, the former looks a real player as he can bat and get his pace up to 140km as well. IMO the AUS pitches/condition are all about 6'6" bowlers hitting the deck hard and trying to intimidate the opposition and swing bowlers are more of a novelty. When banana bender bowlers like Boult and Southee struggle to swing it when they play in Aus who would want be a swing bowler?
And we give the kookaburra the heave-ho to placate the pommie bastards!

For the Duke, which is now of course owned and made in India, more BCCI tenticles?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #241 –
The scary thing about Indian cricket is that their Test players aren't all from private schools now.  Now wonder they have such depth!
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #242 –
Quote from: DJC – on
The scary thing about Indian cricket is that their Test players aren't all from private schools now.  Now wonder they have such depth!
Are you seriously asserting privilege derails, subdues or obstructs progress? :D

How does that work with the caste system? :o
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #243 –
Quote from: LP – on
For the Duke, which is now of course owned and made in India, more BCCI tenticles?

LP

"Currently, the red Dukes cricket ball is used by England, West Indies and Ireland for Test matches. India tends to prefer the locally-manufactured SG cricket ball while the other Test-playing nations use the Australian-manufactured Kookaburra ball".

That's the info I have and not sure they're (the Dukes) are made in India ... perhaps Pakistan

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #244 –
Quote from: capcom – on
LP

"Currently, the red Dukes cricket ball is used by England, West Indies and Ireland for Test matches. India tends to prefer the locally-manufactured SG cricket ball while the other Test-playing nations use the Australian-manufactured Kookaburra ball".

That's the info I have and not sure they're (the Dukes) are made in India ... perhaps Pakistan
I thought that SG bought out the old Duke factory a year or two back, I recall watching a story about it during the last ashes.

I know Australia dominates the sales of the fancy coloured stuff for T20 and ODI, white. yellow, pink, orange, etc., etc. I'm not sure about the traditional pills.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #245 –
Quote from: LP – on
Are you seriously asserting privilege derails, subdues or obstructs progress? :D

How does that work with the caste system? :o
Shubmann Gill is from a well to do family and his father had the plantation/farm workers giving him throw down bouncers to practice his skills...seemed to work well.
Conversely I think Natajaran was plucked from obscurity and his parents were of a humble village background so India must have a very wide network of talent scouts combing all the states and watching cricket at all levels.
The IPL has become a fertile grounding for Indian players and they receive coaching from some of the best in the world both playing and retirees...ie Ricky Ponting is helping train some of those players who beat us and has had a lot to do with players like Pant. No doubt money and resources are huge like the population and its hard to see them ever falling over like what happened to
the West Indies after they ruled world cricket for a decade.

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #246 –
I understand that British Cricket Balls Ltd still makes Dukes balls.  The company has been owned by an expat Indian since the mid 1980s.

The wording of the descriptions of the range of Dukes cricket balls suggests that only the top of the range balls are still manufactured entirely in England:

https://www.dukescricket.co.uk/Dukes_Cricket/Cricket_balls.html
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball
 

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #247 –
Quote from: DJC – on
I understand that British Cricket Balls Ltd still makes Dukes balls.  The company has been owned by an expat Indian since the mid 1980s.

The wording of the descriptions of the range of Dukes cricket balls suggests that only the top of the range balls are still manufactured entirely in England:

https://www.dukescricket.co.uk/Dukes_Cricket/Cricket_balls.html
Fair enough, I'm probably wrong but I'm sure I watched a doco during the last Ashes series talking about the takeover of Duke by an Indian Sporting goods maker SG. The deal was that Duke gain access to a coloured pill technology that competes with Kookaburra, allowing Duke to market coloured pills. To be fair I can't recall if they said manufacture of the traditional balls was moving to India or perhaps it was just the coloured stuff.

It could be that SG bought the old Dukes factory, and Dukes moved to the new location, that might be where I've got it wrong.

I do remember a whole segment in the doco showing the SG using the traditional Dukes techniques for the manufacture of first class pills, all still done by hand.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #248 –
Quote from: LP – on
And we give the kookaburra the heave-ho to placate the pommie bastards!

For the Duke, which is now of course owned and made in India, more BCCI tenticles?

I thought we started using the Duke, for half of the Shield season, so that our guys would have experience with it, prior to an Ashes tour.  Unlike previous tours, where the first time some guys saw a Duke was when they openned a bag of balls in the first net session of the tour.  Actually seemed like a rare logical decision for CA

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #249 –
@LP Perhaps SG manufactures cricket balls for finishing by BCB.  Their website indicates diminishing English involvement in manufacture as you go down the range.  I can imagine a wizened old gaffer sitting at a scarred workbench and lovingly stitching Dukes balls destined for Test cricket.  I hope he has an apprentice  :)
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #250 –
I have a display for my stuff and on one shelf are a pair of RH gloves and in each hand are brand new Kookaburra balls, test and one day.

https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;sa=tmpattach;attach=post_tmp_827_513ea1ca3650f075674ef31263e705da;topic=5301

They weren't cheap and that was 20 years ago

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #251 –
Quote from: DJC – on
@LP Perhaps SG manufactures cricket balls for finishing by BCB.  Their website indicates diminishing English involvement in manufacture as you go down the range.  I can imagine a wizened old gaffer sitting at a scarred workbench and lovingly stitching Dukes balls destined for Test cricket.  I hope he has an apprentice  :)
Not surprised, I remember the doco covering a whole bunch of supply issues.

 For example cattle have changed over the years, cowhides get thicker, thinner or change characteristics subject to breeding practises, so sourcing the right leather is becoming a big issue. Not surprising when you hear it mentioned, everything we humans do to "make stuff better" has some form of unintended impact.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #252 –
Nice display, Capcom.  I think the international balls are still hand made >$120 each (possibly $150 by now).  The 2 piece balls that we play with are $50+ each.  This season with all games being one dayers, it is expensive!

As an aside, a lot of comps have the first couple of grades playing in coloured clothes for one dayers.  The have now reverted to whites, as Kookaburra don't have enough stock of white balls to cover the number of one dayers!

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #253 –
Quote from: tonyo – on
This bowling group has shown on several occasions they cannot get the job done on the last day, especially Lyon.  Should have won the last two tests, but didn't get close in either on a spinning deck. 

Think Stokes in Ashes test as well.

They need to get a bit of snarl into the attack.

The fish rots at the head. Paine is a poor, panicky captain and the players played in that ,ould with great intent. What were his plans, field placings terrible, bowling plans, who knows. Worst captain since Yallop. On the other side Rahane drags a side very depleted, that's used 20 players, to a win they should never have had. That played with great want and intent and got rewarded. We essentially played with two bowlers and two batsmen, with a decent effort from Green. 1-0 up in the series, Paine has the best bowling attack in the world, India’s skipper goes home, they play 20 players, a lot of them no-names, Paine wins the toss three out of four, he stuffs up countless DRS reviews, he drops catches, he misses stumpings, he loses his cool with embarrassing sledging and ultimately he is in charge of a team that loses the unlosable series.

Need to go back to Smith for the SA Tour. Our choices are limited there right now so it's Smith. While never classified as a great captain, he was a good captain, had a ruthless edge good plans, bowlers with in partnerships with constant pressure. We could get the job done on the 5th day. This summer, by contrast, outside the constant use of the short ball how many time did we see consecutive ball in the same spot, a stock ball, building pressure with dots building pressure. What was with Sydney with that constant shot pitched bowling on a dead flat block of concrete. Just like the panicky debacle at Headingley, we were in a dominate position in the last 2 Tests for a draw and a loss against a depleted team. Paine can piss off. Because of Paine's leadership we are out of the top 2 on the WTC Table. top 2 play the final at Lord's. we need to beat SA 2-0. Can do it with Smith, no chance with Paine. Good leaders are everything.

First Test in SA...

Khawaja (short term until we find someone longer term)
Warner
Labuschagne
Smith (c)
Pucovski
Green
Carey
Cummins
Richardson
Lyon (just holds his spot)
Hazelwood

Re: God help me - the Test Cricket thread

Reply #254 –
Quote from: laj – on
The fish rots at the head. Paine is a poor, panicky captain and the players played in that ,ould with great intent. What were his plans, field placings terrible, bowling plans, who knows. Worst captain since Yallop. On the other side Rahane drags a side very depleted, that's used 20 players, to a win they should never have had. That played with great want and intent and got rewarded. We essentially played with two bowlers and two batsmen, with a decent effort from Green. 1-0 up in the series, Paine has the best bowling attack in the world, India’s skipper goes home, they play 20 players, a lot of them no-names, Paine wins the toss three out of four, he stuffs up countless DRS reviews, he drops catches, he misses stumpings, he loses his cool with embarrassing sledging and ultimately he is in charge of a team that loses the unlosable series.

Need to go back to Smith for the SA Tour. Our choices are limited there right now so it's Smith. While never classified as a great captain, he was a good captain, had a ruthless edge good plans, bowlers with in partnerships with constant pressure. We could get the job done on the 5th day. This summer, by contrast, outside the constant use of the short ball how many time did we see consecutive ball in the same spot, a stock ball, building pressure with dots building pressure. What was with Sydney with that constant shot pitched bowling on a dead flat block of concrete. Just like the panicky debacle at Headingley, we were in a dominate position in the last 2 Tests for a draw and a loss against a depleted team. Paine can piss off. Because of Paine's leadership we are out of the top 2 on the WTC Table. top 2 play the final at Lord's. we need to beat SA 2-0. Can do it with Smith, no chance with Paine. Good leaders are everything.

First Test in SA...

Khawaja (short term until we find someone longer term)
Warner
Labuschagne
Smith (c)
Pucovski
Green
Carey
Cummins
Richardson
Lyon (just holds his spot)
Hazelwood
Some fair points Jim, I go with Whiteman at the top of the order.....Saffies attack isnt bad with Rabada and fellow quick Anrich Nortje who is express so I would expect making runs will be hard work but their batting is poor with only Elgar and Dekock as consistent players.
Pity Pattinson isnt fit as he would be my ideal Starc replacement although I am sure Starc will play, Lyon is a question mark player
for me, has a bowling average of 40 vs the Saffies and their grounds are not big. He probably starts 1st test but I'd have Swepson in the touring party as insurance.Like to see Labuschange get more overs, he bowls some rubbish but also bowls some decent stuff and you have to try and fiddle wickets every now and then and its an area Paine struggles to do.
Lot of pressure on Warner who has a good record vs the Saffies and of course Smith, you would expect flat hard wickets again in SA which suits their quicks and I think Warner can turn it around in this short series and be a match winner.
I like Carey but is only averaging 34 in 1st class cricket and thats not enough to demand a place IMO....if I was going a new keeper it would be Ingles from WA and Whiteman would be my reserve keeper.
Pucovski with his concussion issues is  going to be tested with the short stuff  and we will see what he is made of, Saffies play it tougher than most teams and with Nortje going at 156kmh in the IPL its going to be a barrage of bouncers IMO so I hope the umpires are of the neutral variety and not all from Saffie land.
I'll go Aus 2-1 as I expect the players under pressure like Warner and Starc to deliver, should be fun to watch too as the Saffie Crowds are a bit like Collingwood ferals and really give it to our blokes and I expect sandpaper sales to increase for the 1st test..😜