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Topic: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda  (Read 22394 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #90 –
Anybody know why Dow played 2s after being pumped up by Diesel?

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #91 –
Quote from: JonDorotich – on
Anybody know why Dow played 2s after being pumped up by Diesel?

Doesn't explain why...but maybe setting Dow a bit of a challenge.


https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/curnow-in-the-clear-as-voss-praises-new-defender-20220225-p59zq2.html?fbclid=IwAR2vBBQ-zNiN4cY9zruTAq0WXJHhYjVVCrlRUQosAv06M_y2yzn36IBM6bg


Quote
Voss said midfielder Paddy Dow had enjoyed an “exceptional” pre-season but would have to fight for a senior berth. He played in a VFL practice match on Thursday.

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #92 –
OK, so a bit late to the party, but i'll add my 2 cents.

Firstly, Boyd....can't remember who pumped him up from an intraclub, but he was terrible. Turned it over, slow to react i'd have him ranked dead last from all the players who played, and plenty who didn't. Has a lot of work to do.

Secondly, OBrien....despite a couple of early turnovers, i thought he worked his well into the game OK. was one of the few who kept running past for the handball and kept running. Pre-game would've been fighting for Boyds spot as last, but was pleasantly surprised. Not sure he is best 22, but as a fill in, he won't look out of place.

Forwardline...
Charlie had 2 beat multiple opponents because Harry wasn't there. He had a tough day, but wasn't terrible.
Kemp was a poor mans harry, but again, was not terrible. Might make it as a swingman.
SOJ....only knows one way....100%. Give him an inch and he'll take a mile. Kicked at least 2, possibly 3 goals and missed 1 or 2 as well. He's always been up against it, but constantly performs.
Small forwards....owies, durdin....serviceable, but no Eddie.

Backline...
Weitering.....AA this year...even commentators are starting to notice.
McDonald....not as good as i'd hoped, made some errors that you cannot make at AFL level, but worth a shot
McGovern....was good, still have some work to do, but looks like he has found a spot. More games with the 2 above and the defence might start to click.
small(er) backs....Saad and Williams are locks, Saad probably BOG. Newman....bit of a forgotten man, but worthy of a starting spot. Williamson.....still not a fan...too unpredictable, too up and down, too many in front of him.

Midfield/the rest...
Pittonet...gets a bad wrap, still, but probably our best, most consistent ruck since Matty Allen. Kreuzer was clearly better, but injured half the time which hurts his consistency. Pitto will never win any awards, but for a big bloke to hold up his end, lock it in.
Mirkov.....raw, but we know that. Will be better for the run, something to work with.
Cripps.....still tries to do too much, but with the reduced intensity, was more likely to get away with it today. Dominant in the middle.
Cerra....a lot to like about his game today. Nothing overly flashy about it, but did what he needed to do.
Hewitt...less impressive than Cerra, but didn't look out of place. Should still find a spot, but i'd like to see more from him.
Kennedy...like SOJ, always underrated, always gives his all, always performs at a consistent level. Good when moved forward too.
Fisher....looked good, still searching for the absolutely break out game to take him to the next level, but he's close
Newnes+Setterfield. Bodies that don't look out of place, but are not long term options.
Philp....a body that did look out of place. Put him just in front of Boyd IMO. Not hopeful.

One thing i seemed to notice is instead of the bomb long to the hot spot, a more considered, bomb long to the pocket and take the throw in seemed to work. Similar to the Mick Malthouse gameplan when going forward. No point getting the ball inside 50 if you get hurt on the rebound. Get the ball inside 50 and put it in the umpires hand and back yourself in.

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #93 –
Pretty much texted the same thing to my mate regarding the gameplan.

2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #94 –
Quote from: kruddler – on
One thing i seemed to notice is instead of the bomb long to the hot spot, a more considered, bomb long to the pocket and take the throw in seemed to work. Similar to the Mick Malthouse gameplan when going forward. No point getting the ball inside 50 if you get hurt on the rebound. Get the ball inside 50 and put it in the umpires hand and back yourself in.
I think in several of those instances the footage shows we had an open F50 target that was missed, so the perspective that it was some how to plan might be a bit of gilding.

In one case I saw, we had three or four players setup coming in from the right forward pocket and we kicked it straight over their heads to the left of the goal square to the advantage of three defenders, but luckily for us they spilt the mark and we forced a stoppage!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #95 –
Quote from: LP – on
I think in several of those instances the footage shows we had an open F50 target that was missed, so the perspective that it was some how to plan might be a bit of gilding.

In one case I saw, we had three or four players setup coming in from the right forward pocket and we kicked it straight over their heads to the left of the goal square to the advantage of three defenders, but luckily for us they spilt the mark and we forced a stoppage!
The odd occasion we went to the 'open F50 target' it got picked off.

Defenders plug a hole in space with the intention of going back to the hot spot as soon as the ball is kicked. Its a cat and mouse game.
I used to use this tactic as a HF lining up in a zone after a behind. Everytime the FB was looking for a spot to kick to, i'd sag back created space in front of me to encourage him to kick it there. I'd watch his eyes and the moment he'd lock on to his target and shape up to kick it there i'd already be running to that spot ready for a nice intercept and shot on goal.

We don't give the 'loose' defenders enough credit these days. They force players to kick it to the exact spot they want them too and know its going there ahead of time, even before we do. Thats why we used to concede so many goals under teague, we were predictable and got hurt on the rebound. Our kicking skills and/or marking options, were simply not good enough to do that under Teague and Bolton.
Go back to the Ratten days and we had Fevola as the target and the likes of Murphy, Houlihan, Gibbs etc delivering it forward. It could work then as the talent was there.

Going back to the Vossy/Malthouse way, it basically takes the opposition out of it. It doesn't matter if you are playing St. Kilda, North Melbourne, or Richmond or Melbourne. Getting a 50-50 ball from a stoppage in the pocket is basically a given. From there you back Cripps and co to win it and get you a shot.
However, going to the hotspot will yield different results depending on the opposition you are playing. You can win a game by going to the hotspot often, but you can always lose a game by going there often.
You can never lose a game by going to a 50-50 contest in the pocket. You always gain some territory.
There was method to the madness of Mick Malthouse. Hopefully our players, supporters and head honchos at the club can respect Vossy enough to let him do it.

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #96 –
Having Harry on the field would mean that balls directed to the right pocket would be marked and he’d be on his preferred side.

Comparisons with Malthouse’s method are a stretch; we avoided going down the line unless it was the only option.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #97 –
Quote from: DJC – on
Having Harry on the field would mean that balls directed to the right pocket would be marked and he’d be on his preferred side.

Comparisons with Malthouse’s method are a stretch; we avoided going down the line unless it was the only option.
Its far from identical to Malthouse, but the overall philosophy is coming from the same place. That is, attack to your advantage, defend and play the percentages and gain ground as a priority, rather than turn it over.

Ratten and Teague were high risk, high reward.
Bolton was no risk, no reward. lol
Malthouse and Voss seem to be low risk.
 

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #98 –
Fans have a tendency to get cause and effect ar5e about, using the corridor or boundary line is sometimes more about opposition's defensive setup than a deliberate tactic.

Forwards head where they are offered space, the skill is to make use of it wherever it becomes available.

When we got run off the D50 we went straight up the guts multiple times, especially highlighted by a few of Williams line breaking disposals. When the Aints managed to slow us up we went around the boundary line but not always.

Labelling that as a deliberate change of tactics at best seems somewhat arbitrary.

We had forward dominance nearly all game, despite Kemp and SoJ not clunking marks they were nearly always first hands on the pill when appropriately targeted, deliberately slowing up our transition would be a coaching death knell. If Kemp and SoJ had clunked 50% of their chances we'd have won by 6 goals. We were so dominant at times the Aints kept sending Membrey back to fill the gaps!

What I did see in the game which is attributable directly to Voss is far less panicked disposals.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #99 –
Quote from: LP – on
What I did see in the game which is attributable directly to Voss is far less panicked disposals.

That is more about the fact its a pre-season game under less pressure IMO.

We'll agree to disagree on the boundary tactics.

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #100 –
Quote from: LP – on
Fans have a tendency to get cause and effect ar5e about, using the corridor or boundary line is sometimes more about opposition's defensive setup than a deliberate tactic.

Forwards head where they are offered space, the skill is to make use of it wherever it becomes available.

When we got run off the D50 we went straight up the guts multiple times, especially highlighted by a few of Williams line breaking disposals. When the Aints managed to slow us up we went around the boundary line but not always.

Labelling that as a deliberate change of tactics at best seems somewhat arbitrary.

We had forward dominance nearly all game, despite Kemp and SoJ not clunking marks they were nearly always first hands on the pill when appropriately targeted, deliberately slowing up our transition would be a coaching death knell. If Kemp and SoJ had clunked 50% of their chances we'd have won by 6 goals. We were so dominant at times the Aints kept sending Membrey back to fill the gaps!

What I did see in the game which is attributable directly to Voss is far less panicked disposals.

That's pretty much how I saw it LP; corridor unless there's no other option.  When we did go down the wings (usually well inboard of the boundary), many of our forward 50 entries were 45 degree kicks to around true CHF or a bit closer to goal.

I'd categorise Vossy's game style as high risk, high reward but only when the risk isn't too high.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #101 –
Quote from: DJC – on
That's pretty much how I saw it LP; corridor unless there's no other option.  When we did go down the wings (usually well inboard of the boundary), many of our forward 50 entries were 45 degree kicks to around true CHF or a bit closer to goal.

I'd categorise Vossy's game style as high risk, high reward but only when the risk isn't too high.
Yeah, that's how I see it, far less of the bomb it forward regardless type stuff, not that I'm against that when you have someone like BigH in F50. BigH may well have to work harder under Voss, on repeat efforts, but when he gets his chances it is likely they will be cleaner.

One thing with Nthmond's run and gun manic pressure type game is that they have to commit 100% to moving in one direction as a swarm. A patient team that is prepared to yoyo the ball around can probably run them into the ground with direction changes. It will be interesting to see how the rule changes affect Nthmond, because their tackling and dumping tactics could almost get interpreted as a type of delaying. Historically whenever they started to get panelised for it the umpires were been publicly bullied into letting them get away with it by Dimma's eternal media bleating to "Just let them play!"
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #102 –
Quote from: Lods – on
Doesn't explain why...but maybe setting Dow a bit of a challenge.


https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/curnow-in-the-clear-as-voss-praises-new-defender-20220225-p59zq2.html?fbclid=IwAR2vBBQ-zNiN4cY9zruTAq0WXJHhYjVVCrlRUQosAv06M_y2yzn36IBM6bg

Thanks - the coach and Greg Williams both saying he’s had a great pre-season and a number 3 pick and he’ll be fighting for a spot? A bit odd

Re: AFL 2022 - Pre-season - Week 1 vs St. Kilda

Reply #103 –
Quote from: JonDorotich – on
Thanks - the coach and Greg Williams both saying he’s had a great pre-season and a number 3 pick and he’ll be fighting for a spot? A bit odd
Whenever a coach says a player has had a great pre-season, it is code for 'there are no excuses'.......
This is now the longest premiership drought in the history of the Carlton Football Club - more evidence of climate change?