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Topic: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn (Read 8536 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #45 –
Quote from: DJC – on
We will get a “please explain” for that as Pitto didn’t seem to be injured.
Twice he went to ground in the last 5 minutes and struggled to get up off the deck without assistance.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #46 –
The eight is certainly shaping up to be different from 2021

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #47 –
Quote from: laj – on
We look like we have gassed out in the last half of the last 2 matches. Maybe we're not used to running so hard....lol.


Not a joke - I think the high pressure game that we are playing is almost impossible to sustain for an entire match - maybe we will gain further conditioning as the season progresses - if not, we will need to improve the efficiency of plan B for when we need to play some tempo football.

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #48 –
We looked to try and be a bit cute after 1/4 time was how I saw things.....but obviously just from the TV. Gone was the precision kicking into the forward line and a bit of the old fashioned panick kicks and handballs crept back in....Williams a culprit for sure.

But wins over the Hawks have been few and far between over the years so I'll take the 4 points. We've found a way to win all 3 games....twice when we've been behind in the last quarter....and against the Dogs (last year's Grand Finalists) when they were coming hard. In recent years we probably would've lost all 3.

I thought Young showed some really good signs with some confident marks and big spoils. Long term he's probably the second key defensive bloke with McGovern more of an intercept role.

Boyd didn't look up to the tempo at all so probably goes back out for Saad assuming Saad is right to go.

Probably sound like a broken record but Silvagni is just such an important player for us. He plays the perfect 3rd tall option but he's ferocious when it hits the ground and/or if we haven't got the ball. His non-stop running and chasing and tackling sets the example and it was fitting that he kicked the winning goal IMO.

Weitering and Docherty huge down back and I thought Newman was a lot more composed today.

Anyone else notice how good Hewett is at keeping his feet and getting his arms free when tackled so he can still get rid of it? He's been a huge bonus and, along with Kennedy's form, is one of the reasons we're 3-0. Walsh wasn't up to his usual lofty standards but when Hewett and Kennedy step up, it doesn't hurt us as much.

GC won't be an easy one either, especially up there but we've got the forward line and midfield more than capable of winning....dare to dream of a 4-0 start.

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #49 –
Gov - I'm convinced more than ever the player we missed was Gov, he has the ability to deliver some stability when we try to change momentum, then he can kick the eyes out of a crow at 50m, and when he does we change direction and all of a sudden we score.

Walsh might be professional and extremely talented, but it's obvious he's struggling fitness and strength wise having missed a chunk of pre-season.

Cerra might be cleared to play, but COVID or something has impacted his running ability.

De Koning struggled a bit, he started the season like a train but has gone off the boil, he might be carrying an injury and has lost elevation and timing in ruck contests. Some of this will be due to the weird umpiring penalties we have copped in the ruck, we shouldn't be changing the ruck tactics, we should be asking for a please explain from certain umpires about certain decisions and telling Pittonet and De Koning to ignore the aberration. When an umpire does a shizen bounce it's not the ruck's responsibility to clear out and give his opponent a free run, the ruck has a right to hold his ground and defend the fall of the ball! But the real problem is that when Nankervis does it he is not penalised, but when Pitto does it he's pinged for blocking, it's bullshizen variable umpiring!

Given the good form of BigH and Charlie, we have become a bit more predictable, we stopped picking out those smaller options as often and just started bombing it long to the taller timber too often.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #50 –
We lost structure and they tightened up in our forward line as the bombs continued, but not to our advantage and didn't have the same presence on the ground for the spills as in the first quarter.

The first quarter was great, second half, we lost our one-touch skills and started fumbling a lot - as well as slipping over a bit.

I thought Kennedy took a couple of really nice marks early, that had they been spilled we may have been in trouble.

I was at the game, great being in a big crowd again - the noise when the Hawks hit the front was pretty impressive, but not as good when we got back in front (although was pretty loud when Durdin kicked the goal that ended up being touched).

I'm getting too old, so find it hard to tell who has been a standout at the game.  There were a few great kicks by LOB, some of H's chasing was great, some great marks, Jack S had a really good game - his last quarter just kept on presenting and being an option.

CJ had an excellent 3rd quarter for Hawks, but we did keep kicking it to him. 

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #51 –
For those playing at home, the issue wasn't what we did, its what the hawks did.

They were able to get 6 to the full back line and run out of defense whilst we were content to keep entering deeply.

We should have been eyeing off spares up the ground but the hawks were disciplined and we had too many trying to press up which meant they could rebound easily.

That was their only game against us, playing counter punch footy and I think voss was happy with that because it allows you to attack as you need to.  Where it broke down was the ability to bring the ball to ground in the forward line.

Credit to hawthorn for making our strength our weakness.

The art for our boys is knowing how to change it and react because we were stuck trying to ram it in and didn't do enough to create separation in the forward line.  At least that's how I saw It.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #52 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
For those playing at home, the issue wasn't what we did, its what the hawks did.

They were able to get 6 to the full back line and run out of defense whilst we were content to keep entering deeply.
Those of you who were at the ground may also have noticed at least once the game resumed with only 5 in the Dawks F50, the warning they got was actually a 2nd offence not the first. Our fans and players were actually remonstrating to umpires at the time and umpire Leigh Fisher ignored it. Some Dawks fans were claiming they had one short on the field as a defence, but no Dawks ran into the F50 until after the next restart.

In any case, if that is true and you are one short on the field, is that legal under the current rules?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #53 –
Things that would have been strange if we said them 12 months ago..... ;D

We really missed McGovern!
Kennedy notches up his 3rd 30 disposal game in a row!

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #54 –
An interesting perspective that I heard today was:
- Ironically what got us to that big lead (playing style) ultimately got us to conceding it
- Making changes to stop a run is a short term view (ie within a game), coninuing to play to your identity is the long term view and may cost a win or two along the way.
I thought that was a pretty interesting way to look at it.
Similar to what ol mate Thry says in #51 (Credit to hawthorn for making our strength our weakness)
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #55 –
Quote from: Gointocarlton – on
An interesting perspective that I heard today was:
- Ironically what got us to that big lead (playing style) ultimately got us to conceding it
- Making changes to stop a run is a short term view (ie within a game), coninuing to play to your identity is the long term view and may cost a win or two along the way.
I thought that was a pretty interesting way to look at it.
Similar to what ol mate Thry says in #51 (Credit to hawthorn for making our strength our weakness)

I was just going to say similar to your first point (and Thry's) but expand on it a bit.

There was 1 obvious difference between the first quarter and the rest. In the first quarter, we literally clunked everything. Harry, Charlie, Jack, Cripps all took big marks I50 in the first quarter. Commentators were raving about how many CM's we had taken and we're at the average early in the 2nd quarter.

From there though, we didn't take those marks (or enough, at the same frequency) and the ball was well cleared as a result.
The big forwards were on fire early and our mids got lazy as a result. "Bomb it up, someone will mark it." worked early, but not often enough later on. Hawks were awake to it and chopping everything off and rebounding, quickly, from there. We were chasing a lot more tail because of it, and ultimately tiring ourselves out......which exacerbated the problem.

In R1, it was the smalls and mids.
In R2, it was the talls.
In R3, it started with the talls, and the smalls barely got a lookin because the ball never hit the deck.
 

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #56 –
Quote from: dodge – on
We lost structure and they tightened up in our forward line as the bombs continued, but not to our advantage and didn't have the same presence on the ground for the spills as in the first quarter.

The first quarter was great, second half, we lost our one-touch skills and started fumbling a lot - as well as slipping over a bit.

I thought Kennedy took a couple of really nice marks early, that had they been spilled we may have been in trouble.

I was at the game, great being in a big crowd again - the noise when the Hawks hit the front was pretty impressive, but not as good when we got back in front (although was pretty loud when Durdin kicked the goal that ended up being touched).

I'm getting too old, so find it hard to tell who has been a standout at the game.  There were a few great kicks by LOB, some of H's chasing was great, some great marks, Jack S had a really good game - his last quarter just kept on presenting and being an option.

CJ had an excellent 3rd quarter for Hawks, but we did keep kicking it to him. 
Thought Hawthorn went harder at the ball in the second half, their kid mids like Worpel, Newcombe, McDonald wanted it more and few of our blokes thought the job was done and stopped contesting and chasing.
We have the weapons and class now to kick big scores and win shootouts so I'm expecting opposing teams to be a lot more physical and turn games into scrimmages and ugly contests to bring us back to the field a bit.

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #57 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
We have the weapons and class now to kick big scores and win shootouts so I'm expecting opposing teams to be a lot more physical and turn games into scrimmages and ugly contests to bring us back to the field a bit.
Yep, dealing with that is the next big test, it's the difference between being a good side and being the next Nthmond.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #58 –
We need to kick the ball so our talls can run and hit the pack on the move. We continually kick onto their heads and they just stand their and jump which is easily defended.
When they are on the move watch out, such as Harry's last mark on the wing.

Still get worried when LOB has the ball. Seems to put his team mates under pressure with his decision making. Yes he can run and yes he can kick the ball but... he seems like a very talented, fit VFL player. Good but not quite there.

Great to finally watch a game with SOME confidence that we have a great chance of winning. It;'s only been 21 years.
Great work Vossy, love the Vosswagen!
2025... Moir of the same to come

Re: AFL Rd 3 2022 Post Game Permutations Carlton vs Hawthorn

Reply #59 –
Quote from: Lods – on
Things that would have been strange if we said them 12 months ago..... ;D

We really missed McGovern!
Kennedy notches up his 3rd 30 disposal game in a row!

Just on Gov, I think he is a defender who is attacking but can actually defend (which is a lost art with all the zoning BS).
IMO Defenders who can actually defend are worth their weight in gold, they win you games (eg Weiters yesterday). Weiters is a gun, a pure defender who is selfless. I think Gov has the similar traits, I think Saad is a very good small defender as is Doc.
The rest? There are a couple who I believe will cost us games and this needs a serious look at by the coaches.
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership