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Topic: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton (Read 48044 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #165 –
Quote from: DJC – on
Coniglio gesticulated and shouted "How is that not a free kick?"  That might be a question grammatically, but in the context and manner in which it was made, it was dissent.

It was interesting to hear umpires calling in to the ABC and applauding the decision.  They all mentioned how difficult it is to attract and retain umpires in local and junior competitions because of the dissent and abuse.  My son-in-law was umpiring his son's under 9 team and had to send a player off for dissent.  Coniglio's behaviour was basically the same as the under 9 kid.

My son who has adhd got sent off in an auskick game last year because he complained about being tackled which isn't allowed. He was upset and ran out of the whole reserve, guess who had to chase him lol? Thanks umpire.

This year he's playing basketball, loves it. Football sux which is a shame as he is good.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #166 –
No way what Coniglio did was dissent.

If we're looking for reasons why umpire numbers and retention is down, I'd say look at parents, kids coaches, their peers, the media and fans before you look at players. Out of those groups I just mentioned, players are the least abusive / dissenting / critical  by far. You could fill a book copying and pasting negative comments on here about umps. Go to any football game (kids, AFL, VFL you name it), and listen to the crowds giving the umpires a few gentle words of encouragement. Listen to adults at a family function discussing among themselves what No 22 did., within earshot of kids.  Kids learn from a young age that umpires are fair game, and only a small amount of what is learnt comes from the Cogs' of this world.

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #167 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
The only people defending the decision are the AFL and Carlton supporters.
Even a lot of usually pro umpire commentators like Dunstall don't understand why that one got picked out.

Not really.  As I mentioned previously, Hudson virtually predicted it in the first quarter and many umpires called the ABC to express their support for the decision. 

I think that what has got some commentators confused is that it was a free kick and not a 50 metre penalty.  50 metre penalties for dissent rarely raise an eyebrow.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #168 –
They're confused all of the other complaining incidents were not paid. Numerous other incidents were highlighted.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #169 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
My son who has adhd got sent off in an auskick game last year because he complained about being tackled which isn't allowed. He was upset and ran out of the whole reserve, guess who had to chase him lol? Thanks umpire.

This year he's playing basketball, loves it. Football sux which is a shame as he is good.

That's not good.

I'm glad that he likes basketball but it would be nice if he could get back into footy.

The kid my son-in-law sent off was generally quite pleasant and engaged in polite conversations with the umpires.  However, he punched another kid after a good tackle and repeatedly questioned umpires' decisions that went against him.  When he came back onto the ground, he accused a goal umpire of cheating for correctly paying a goal.  His coach thanked my son-in-law for sending him off and wished more umpires would do the same.  Of course, the umpires are just parents with no formal training or umpiring expertise.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #170 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
They're confused all of the other complaining incidents were not paid. Numerous other incidents were highlighted.
SoJ must have been close to getting pinged in the last quarter as well.

I'm surprised more forwards do not get pinged as they are always begging, for example how the feck can it be possible that Jack Riewoldt isn't done over at least five times a game?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #171 –
I was goal umpiring U16s once and a kid snapped a shot on goal that was touched by one of the players nearest him, he momentarily reacted like he knew it was touched, then he threw his arms up in the air and charged off claiming it was a goal. I signalled touched and he complained to the central umpire, who came down to ask me what happened. By then this kid was charging towards his bench shouting loudly it was a goal, but it was clearly touched and everybody in the vicinity knew it, they even moved off quickly to setup for the kick in. The kid wouldn't give up and kept making smart-ar5e comments through the remainder of the game, which caused some spectators to confront me as I left the ground. But it was obviously touched and some of his own team stated as much.

Later that season in another game a talented footballer got pegged holding the ball as he tried to sprint clear the middle, he screamed an expletive out loudly which is not allowed in the Unders and he abused the umpire claiming he'd handballed which he of course hadn't, this caused a 50m penalty. His father started hurling abuse from the boundary line and jogged around the fence, the kid kept up the abuse egged on by his parent as he came back to the mark and the umpire gave him another 50m to the goal line. When the kid got to the mark on the goal line he grabbed the youngish central umpire by the head and threw a knee into the umpires face with a martial arts style action. Like snapping a branch over your knee. That kid was probably heading to the AFL, it ended his career and the young umpire never officiated again.

This is why umpiring abuse is not on, under any circumstance. The AFL is the custodian of the sport, it needs to act to ensure it's future.

I was very disappointed when Alistair The Angry Ant Clarkson got off so lightly for abusing the regional umpire, the AFL had an opportunity then to send a message and it whimped out. The AFL lives a double standard!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #172 –
The Coniglio decision wouldnt even have registered a tech foul in basketball, players throw their hands up all the time, point to where they have been fouled and bail up referees for an explanation all the time.
The Umps called that free out of nowhere after going soft on dissent calls because it got ridiculous last season and now have suddenly called that one at a crucial point in the match.
There was no foul language or threatening behaviour...we got a lucky break which is great and went onto win the game but the reality is we had some divine intervention help us which is fine because its our turn for a change of luck but GWS got stitched up with the Cogs free and the non call on Harry too who dropped the ball(incorrect disposal when tackled imho), yep he was held onto a bit long after that but I believe the free was there before that.
We will either see a lot of dissent calls this week or nothing depending on how the umpires have been told to adjudicate the game in this area. If its nothing then they would have decided it was a over zealous call on Coniglio and it wont happen like that again...

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #173 –
A free kick at the top of the goal square is a very heavy price to pay for dissent BUT it is no worse than a 50 metre penalty that moves a player to a similar position for dissent or one of any number of trivial technicalities.

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #174 –
Quote from: PaulP – on
It's a terrible decision. Imagine if we lose a GF because Cripps questions an unpaid free. The AFL needs to find another way of dealing with this. It's not an infringement where players are deliberately doing illegal things to alter the state of play in their favour. There's no cheating,  jumper holding, deliberate OOB etc. You can't have this tiggy touchwood nonsense affecting a result. Hand out heavy fines, suspend the player for the following match etc. But don't change the outcome because some player says boo.

Once upon a time, someone said the same thing about the running through the mark rule.

Jimmy Stynes found out the hard way and cost his team a goal, and ultimately a spot in the grand final.
You reckon he ever made that mistake again?

....and thats the point.
Make a big statement about it and make it mean something and players will start to take notice.

You could pay 10 of them in nothing parts of the ground, in a game that was a blowout and nobody would learn anything. Pay 1 like that and everybody takes notice.

Yes it sucks. Thankfully it went our way. It will be less likely to occur in the future, because players will learn from it and you have that decision to thank for it.

Think back to the pre-season game last year when we played the Dees. Umpires had just been spruiking the dissent rule in the off-season. From memory, we learned pretty quick, but the Dees did not. I think there was something like 8 50m penalties for backchat and dissent. Dees learned their lesson eventually.

...and thats the thing with these rules as well. You go hard early and set a tone...then ease off when the games really matter and finals. Happens with all rules.

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #175 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
We will either see a lot of dissent calls this week or nothing depending on how the umpires have been told to adjudicate the game in this area. If its nothing then they would have decided it was a over zealous call on Coniglio and it wont happen like that again...

Or coaches will have instructed players not to show dissent …
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball
 

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #176 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
Whitfield questioned the umpire over the dissent free, why didn't we get another kick?

Reason......because he is not Italian!*

You laugh, then you realise, thats its actually a legitimate reason.

Italians speak with their hands and arms. Its cultural. Cogs probably can't help it.
Harsh as it may seem, you can't take that into consideration when talking about the 'look' of the incident.


*Its ok, i can say that, i'm half Italian ;)

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #177 –
If you get pinged for dissent next weekend you should proabably give yourself an uppercut. ;)  :D

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #178 –
Quote from: kruddler – on
Reason......because he is not Italian!*

You laugh, then you realise, thats its actually a legitimate reason.

Italians speak with their hands and arms. Its cultural. Cogs probably can't help it.
Harsh as it may seem, you can't take that into consideration when talking about the 'look' of the incident.


*Its ok, i can say that, i'm half Italian ;)

Mum ma Mia!

Re: AFL Rd 3 2023 Post Game Prognostications Giants vs Carlton

Reply #179 –
I enjoyed the 60s, 70s and 80s where the players would give it to the umpires, umpires would give it back, and there was a real mutual respect. After all that during a game the umpires would then join players from both sides in the social club after the game for a beer. Decisions would be discussed, all enjoyed a beer and all go home happy. Probably the limit was calling the umpire a f idiot and even then umpires just passed that over often too.

Still remember Umpire Glenn James coming to our 1982 B & F, sitting with the players and mingling. He a good laugh when Ian Rice happily said "who can remember the magnificent coathanger delivered by  Jimmy Buckley to Mick Malthouse in round 20, oh, I forgot, Glenn James is here" (it was a ripper of a coathanger too). I reckon there was so much more respect, player to umpire and vise versa back then (maybe Diesel and John Russo excepted)