Carlton Supporters Club

I suppose it's possible Mirkov has lost a lot of aerobic capacity, strength and condition from his health issues, so it might take time to regain that.

He looked to have enough to persist with before his health issues, probably deserves another run at it if he wants it.

Mirkov is Robert Warnock revisited......watched him vs the Northern Bullants and he didnt take a mark and the opposition was very suburban and thats being kind. Has no physical presence much like Warnock and even though he usually wins the hitout count its never enough to impact the game and we got slaughtered at the stoppages..
As I said on the other thread its time to end the experiment unless Matt Kreuzer can get some change in gamestyle between now and seasons end.

The ladder is a fairly neat encapsulation of the body of work a team has produced thus far, but not necessarily a fair representation of where a team is in the moment. The Lions play the Demons tomorrow, and despite the ladder saying the Demons are 9th and the Lions 10th, the form line suggests that these teams are miles apart and seemingly headed in different directions. I would not be at all surprised to see Brisbane win by 10 goals.

What were you saying about the difference between these teams?

Like it or not, we were bottom 4 basically this time last year and were playing like it. Hawks and Freo may have even been favourites. I don't know where to find historical odds to check.

What were you saying about the difference between these teams?

Like it or not, we were bottom 4 basically this time last year and were playing like it. Hawks and Freo may have even been favourites. I don't know where to find historical odds to check.

The ladder most definitely lies from from time to time, but not last night. My opinion was pretty much in keeping with the consensus view. Nobody gave Melbourne a chance.

With all due respect lods, your take on last season is tainted by current performances and flat out wrong.

You are saying that you can't look at mid season form and need to look at end of season finishing position. What is the difference? Both are some arbitrary number of games plucked out of a hat. If the season went 5 more rounds for some reason  you'd get a different top 8 and potentially a different premier.
So which is the true indication of actual talent?

Vossy says the ladder doesn't lie.
You are saying it lied then.

All the media speculation about sacking vossy, for months, has been quickly forgotten. We were a rabble. Had it been previous head hinchos in charge we would have another coach currently.

Your dismissal of our team performance (with no rucks) against very much our peers at the time and against a top 3 ruck at the time in Darcy is twisting history to suit your argument.
The fact that we not only on won, but won by 9 goals, in the west, is monumental effort.
The train of thought that we need a backup ruck in case our #1 ruck gets injured is for an emergency scenario that may never exist.....and even when it did, it didn't matter.

Do you think that had we had 2 rucks playing in that game against freo that we would've performed better than a 9 goal win? You're dreaming.

In the Hawks post match, Voss said both De Koning and Pittonet are a chance to be available for this game, but he seemed a little equivocal. One or preferably both will be essential IMO. Jack Silvagni was good this week, but I don't believe that level of output is sustainable. Freo are a little hit and miss, but certainly a step up from the Hawks. I'd expect the betting odds to be pretty close. A very 50/50 game for mine

.....

Yes. The bye is recent enough for him to still be fresh. But Darcy and Jackson are a whole other level, and close to the best ruck combination going around, and if neither De Koning nor Pittonet play, Silvagni will be spent by half time IMO. Darcy in particular will crash and bash with glee.

The ruck discrepancy is significant enough to wonder whether there's anything to be gained by even contesting them. I'd be tempted to contest a small number and for Silvagni and Young to be deployed somewhere more useful. Hopefully our mids have trained wearing purple

I can see the appeal of that type of thinking. Work on the basis that they will end up with the ball first. Make the Freo mids the hunted, lots of close checking and body work, once they have the ball, then try to force the turnover. Easier said than done of course, but so is everything

At the end of the year you've played every side at least once.

They weren't our peers when we played them....we'd gone past them at the rate of knots
The ladder lied.
Matches either side of those two games against GC and Port showed just how much we'd gone past those other two sides...and how our ladder position was no longer relevant in comparison.

Wrong.

See Paul's quote as an actual snapshot in time.

https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?topic=6480.60
You yourself made no predictions or comments on the relative strengths of the side

People take some time to adjust to the reality of what is happening in a teams performance.
At that point of time we were all probably a bit gun shy.
Was the turnaround sustainable...or just a flash in the pan.
Anyone thinking top 6 was probably considered a supreme optimist.

We had a bottom 4 mentality as supporters....but our team had already gone past that.
We weren't on a par with Hawthorn and Freo any longer.
We were better, much better.
And with one of our ruckman back the following week we didn't just beat the 14th or 16th side by 50 points
We beat the 'second' placed side by 50 points.

OK, so the ladder is wrong.
Which makes Vossy wrong.
I am wrong.
PaulP was wrong.
The bookies were wrong.

You were right.

Yeah, nah.

At that point in time, everyone was right......and you didn't voice an opinion.

I wasn't right...I was careful.
As you say I probably didn't voice an opinion.
I'll tell you who probably did think the ladder didn't reflect our true ability...the players      

Poor example.
Name me 2 teams that the players think there ladder position reflects their true ability.
Sydney is one....
Everyone else thinks they are better than their ladder position reflects.