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Topic: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility (Read 12047 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #15 –
Does the media use the term 'mental health' issues that often when referring to players?

'Personal issues' seems to me the more encompassing terminology that both the media and clubs use.
And that's used as a pretty broad brush that seems to cover players with addiction, personal and relationship problems and behavioural issues.

The problem is that is so unspecific, and the player does have their right to privacy. It then opens it up to a range of rumour and speculation with some folks usually declaring "I know for a fact...." what the problem is.

And you can bet your bottom dollar that "fact" gets a run on multiple social media platforms....which further compounds the problem for the player.

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #16 –
Quote from: Lods – on
Does the media use the term 'mental health' issues that often when referring to players?

'Personal issues' seems to me the more encompassing terminology that both the media and clubs use.
And that's used as a pretty broad brush that seems to cover players with addiction, personal and relationship problems and behavioural issues.

The problem is that is so unspecific, and the player does have their right to privacy. It then opens it up to a range of rumour and speculation with some folks usually declaring "I know for a fact...." what the problem is.

And you can bet your bottom dollar that "fact" gets a run on multiple social media platforms....which further compounds the problem for the player.

I think 'mental health' and 'personal issues' are somewhat interchangeable from the media....and thats a large part of the problem, there is no distinction, no diagnosis, no accountability.

Yes, there is privacy and thats why i don't think it will ever come in.....but if it did....it would solve a lot of problems.

Of course when i think of privacy from players, i'm immediately drawn to AFLPA agreeing to extra drug testing with no penalities as long as there is privacy. The requirement for privacy is being abused.

In the NFL, they are paid VERY well, and as a result, they give up most of their privacy. Their salaries are public, their discretions are made public, there drug issues are made public.

Perhaps if we want to pay these human beings large quantities of cash for playing a game they would probably pay for free, they may have to give up something in return.....a degree of privacy.
If the rules were changed, then players would always have the choice of playing AFL footy or not before choosing that life path comes with pros and cons and they can choose to NOT take that path if privacy is that important to them.

Currently players are running the AFL.......and we have more 'issues' than ever before. Perhaps we take back some of the power and help the community by destigmatising these issues and reporting them more accurately and stop covering up player indescretions in the process.

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #17 –
Quote from: Gointocarlton – on
IMO opinion, right or wrong, poor life choices are not mental health issues.

Sorry GTC, way too black and white and simplistic. I guess you would condemn me for my poor choice of addiction/alcoholism when trying to escape the horrible memories of what I saw in a war zone - PTSD, so am I a weak pr*ck for the poor choice of escaping through grog? The word 'choice' assumes complete total and healthy awareness of everything... including every possible consequence. Never met a person who could do that.

First question to ask when someone makes a poor life choice is why? Not abuse, condemn, judge and dismiss them. We are still learning about the human mind/psychology, emotions and spirituality.

A mental health issue mistake does NOT mean excuse. Never has been, never will be. It's all about reason. Education and understanding give us a much better insight into how to address issues and hence deal with them and grow & heal.

And man, how big is this term 'mental health.' What does it mean? What exactly is mental health v mental illness? In many cultures being gay is a mental illness - a bad choice punishable by death! Sheesh, a global leader, Elon Musk, recently announced that empathy is a weakness! FFS.

A simple example. A clown cuts off an angry bloke in traffic. The angry bloke gets out and beats the shizen out of the other bloke. Do we excuse the angry bloke because he's depressed over his missus rooting another bloke? No. He gets punished AND he gets meaningful treatment for his depression so he doesn't do it again!

I'd better stop now as I feel a rant/lecture coming on
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #18 –
Quote from: Baggers – on
Quote from: Gointocarlton – on
IMO opinion, right or wrong, poor life choices are not mental health issues.

Sorry GTC, way too black and white and simplistic.
Sorry Baggers, that's me in a nutshell, black and white and simplistic.
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #19 –
I had the misfortune of sitting near the interchange down near the boundary.

Footy fans are disgraceful. 

No wonder playing for teams performing badly sees players in a rut they can't break out of.  There is plenty of "feedback" for the players.

Something is up at the club though.  The body language between the two benches at 3/4 time was palpable from even both sets of the club doctors, water carriers physios etc.  All of the doggies were way more up and about.

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #20 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
I had the misfortune of sitting near the interchange down near the boundary.

Footy fans are disgraceful. 

No wonder playing for teams performing badly sees players in a rut they can't break out of.  There is plenty of "feedback" for the players.

Something is up at the club though.  The body language between the two benches at 3/4 time was palpable from the club doctors, water carriers physios etc.  All of them were way more up and about.


I heard Cooney speak about this passionately on radio this arvo. He made a good point about the bronx cheers Ben McKay was receiving last night saying what fan thinks going to the game and booing or bronx cheering your own player is going to have a constructive outcome?
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time
2025-Carlton can win the 2025 AFL Premiership

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #21 –
How about our mental health...  Thirty years welded on to the most depressing relationship, supporting this f****d up exercise.
Joke coaching.
Joke list management.
Joke selections.
Joke fitness regime.
Keep wheeling out the same crap trucks who don't deliver week after week.
Same players making the same mistakes.

Supporting Carlton is an abusive relationship.
DrE is no more... you ok with that harmonica man?

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #22 –
Quote from: Professer E – on
How about our mental health...  Thirty years welded on to the most depressing relationship, supporting this f****d up exercise.
Joke coaching.
Joke list management.
Joke selections.
Joke fitness regime.
Keep wheeling out the same crap trucks who don't deliver week after week.
Same players making the same mistakes.

Supporting Carlton is an abusive relationship.
mate, I empathise whole heartedly.

All I can offer you is perspective.  People wonder  why do bad things happen to people.  Why do they get sick.  Why do people die young.

I think this is nature (or if you are religious Gods) way of teaching everyone perspective and how we should be greatful for the good, and recognise the bad for what they are.

It's just footy.

I attended a funeral of a 49 year old woman 2 weeks ago.  Her husband is a relative of mine.  His mum passed away at the same age when he was still a youngster.  He had the misfortune of finding his dad dead in bed a few years later.  So orphaned as a pre teen/teenager, he and his older brother were effectively raised by my uncle and aunty. 

If he can find the strength to continue living life in the face of adversity, then we must remember its just footy.

Whilst our players frustrate the hell out of me at times these are all young men, playing football.  If some of the fan noise and yelling I hear was said to a child of mine, I don't know how I'd react.

It's just footy.  It's been a hard time, but thats what made the last couple of seasons so worthwhile.   Stick fat the wheel will turn.

I too am impatient, but the one thing that I learned out of 2012 was that impatience can lead to catastrophe and sometimes understanding where you're at is more important than worrying about where you aren't.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #23 –
We've stuck fat for 30 years.  Our window has closed.  We're looking at another rebuild.  Another ten years.  Ar least.
DrE is no more... you ok with that harmonica man?

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #24 –
Quote from: Professer E – on
We've stuck fat for 30 years.  Our window has closed.  We're looking at another rebuild.  Another ten years.  Ar least.

The only thing we stuck fat to over the past 30 years is knee jerk reactions.
That is why we've seen what we've seen.

Break the cycle and stop with the sack the coach BS.
Sack the recruiters who have hamstrung who the coach can actually pick! That's where the issue is.

I said at the time but the selling the farm for Jagga was ridiculous and counter productive.

Hawks are laughing their butts off at the moment with our 1st round pick next year.
Meanwhile we got nothing but hopes and dreams to show for it.

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #25 –
Let's keep the thread on track. ;)
We have a number of other threads to discuss the mental impact on long suffering football supporters.
 

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #26 –
I think intimately tethering your mental health to the fortunes of your football club is a lose-lose relationship, not helpful for supporters and not helpful for players / coaches etc. By all means ride the bumps, the highs / lows etc, but if you're adversely affecting your own health and the health of the players and others, then it's time to re calibrate, give up on AFL or support a different team. We don't want any more Jason Castagnas who are bullied out of the game (mostly based on ignorance), and we don't want any more supporters whose lives are adversely affected.

IMO, every AFL club is a complex system. There's actually very little that coaches etc. players can control. Rather than the outdated machine / parts model used to understand clubs, we need to shift to more adaptive models, that more accurately reflect reality.

If we don't have access to all the facts, we should suspend both judgment and condemnation.

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #27 –
Apparently both H and Elijah played in a rescheduled VFL practice match yesterday. Both got through. Elijah was apparently somewhat rusty and not in contention for a while yet. The news on H was more positive.
To be honest, no matter how much I'd like to have both guys available, I hope they are in a better place first and foremost.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #28 –
Keep him away from the team until we start winning.  I shudder to think the pile on and what it will do to him if he fails to perform, it costs us a game, and he doesn't strike me as a player that thrives under pressure.

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Mental Health/Illness Education, Empathy & Responsibility

Reply #29 –
Quote from: crashlander – on
Apparently both H and Elijah played in a rescheduled VFL practice match yesterday. Both got through. Elijah was apparently somewhat rusty and not in contention for a while yet. The news on H was more positive.
To be honest, no matter how much I'd like to have both guys available, I hope they are in a better place first and foremost.

Agree. Don't want to force them to play simply because of our win/loss record.
Only pick them when they are ready. Otherwise we risk losing them both again.