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VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Not on TC this week; instead our game starts at 12:05 at Carlton on Friday.
I read some time ago that the game was going to be around 16:00, but that appears no longer the case. To get Brissie back to Brissie sooner?

Very interested to see what our line-up is like:
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #1 –
Finally our line-up is available:
CARLTON
B: B. Wilson (35), E. Phillips (55), M. Duffy (41)
HB: H. Charleson (28), J. Boyd (37), R. Monahan (34)
C: B. Acres (13), J. Binns (25), L. Camporeale (21)
HF: W. White (38), D. Hogg (70), L. Nelson (57)
F: H. O'Keeffe (40), H. Lemmey (31), F. Evans (44)
R: F. Riley (56), B. Camporeale (16), H. Ramshaw (51)
Int: O. Warburton (78), C. Vickery (59), A. Stevens (77), P. Dozzi (53), D. Grainger-Barras (61)
23rd Player: O. Warburton (78)
Em: K. Ferronato (50), O. Badr (62), S. Phipps-Parsons (69), N. King (63), J. Polkinghorne (76), T. Logan (68), Z. Harding (60)

IN: B. Acres, F. Evans, H. O'Keeffe, A. Stevens
OUT: C. Durdin, F. Young (AFL), L. Young (ankle), W. Hayes (unavailable)

BRISBANE LIONS
B: L. Lloyd (19), D. Joyce (41), Z. Zakostelsky (21)
HB: T. Doedee (12), K. Coleman (18), L. Beecken (17)
C: B. Reville (38), J. Tunstill (29), J. Creighton (57)
HF: S. Marshall (20), W. McLachlan (28), D. Craven (45)
F: C. McKenna (26), T. Gallop (22), B. Ryan (24)
R: H. Smith (25), D. Robertson (2), R. Torrent (36)
INT: S. Brain (34), M. Owen (47), T. Abberley (48), F. McFadyen (58), C. McCarthy (65)
23rd Player: M. Owen (47)
EMG: T. Meekin (52), C. Offermans (56), W. Greenaway (59), R. Gilder (60), J. Fazldeen (65), D. Lloyd (67)

IN: S. Brain, K. Coleman, T. Doedee, T. Gallop, F. McFadyen, M. Owen, H. Smith
OUT: J. Manly (personal), C. Murray (Allies), J. Fazldeen, R. Gilder, W. Greenaway, T. Meekin, B. Thomas (omitted)
NEW: Matthew Owen, 17, 179cm, Brisbane Lions Academy/Redland-Victoria Point

My comments:
[1] We're still a very short team, but having Skull back is a big improvement.
[2] We'll miss Will Hayes again, but he probably has racing commitments.
[3] Brisbane have a LOT of AFL listed players available. We haven't had that many for so long, although we did give it a sniff in the first couple of rounds.
[4] If we win, it will be a huge win. Not like, though. They have so much talent available that we just don't.
[5] Interesting to see how Grainer-Barras pulls up.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #2 –
Quarter time and the Blues are a goal up!
Carlton: 3 - 2 - 20
Brisbane: 2 - 2 - 14

Goals: Lemmey, White & Wilson.

Possessions:
Ethan Phillips: 9 possessions, 6 marks!
Jordan Boyd: 6 possessions.

Brisbane have 7 of the top 9 possession getters.
Not a lot among our mids to this point.

The ball has been living in the Brisbane forward line, but we've had a lot more tackles.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #3 –
I tell you what, if we want to get a player that can help us on the cheap, Deven Robertson is the player.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #4 –
Harry Charleson can kick it very long.

Jordan Boyd happy to take the game on. 

For a team that lacks run off half back, and is insistent on using Ollie Hollands in that role, Im not sure why we have so many half backs and then insist on using Hollands down there when we are cheating with mids on the wing.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #5 –
Lemmey moves like the titanic.  Big turning circle, not much pace.  Showed some endeavour to get back and attempt a tackle just then, but he is very one dimensional. 
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #6 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Lemmey moves like the titanic.  Big turning circle, not much pace.  Showed some endeavour to get back and attempt a tackle just then, but he is very one dimensional. 
He is certainly consistent in this (lack of) mobility.

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #7 –
Whoever said about Evans getting a game, and spweing up, I would have my bucket ready for next week.

He is once again putting his hand up and making a stake for AFL footy.  I dont like the guy, he isnt good enough, but you cannot accuse him of not trying.   

Billy Wilson should also come in next week.

Dissapointed in Acres.  He has been busy but hasnt looked a class above this level. 

Lucas Campo may have done enough.  Binns hasnt been terrible, and we will need wingers next week but we have a 9 day break to next saturday.

Id be moving Hollands back onto a wing, and bringing in Wilson and Charleson in based on what I have seen.  We need to see what Charleson can do at AFL level, and Id like Carroll to be better defensively.  Boyd is another one who could come in.  Depends on the MC.  Watch Acres come back in.  Ed Langdon runs all day and will need someone like Hollands to go with him.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Whoever said about Evans getting a game, and spweing up, I would have my bucket ready for next week.
It wasn't me, but i share the sentiment.

Evans is not the future.
Let him dominate at VFL level, but playing him at AFL shows gives us nothing both now and in the future. Play a kid in his place.

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #9 –
Quote from: kruddler – on
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Whoever said about Evans getting a game, and spweing up, I would have my bucket ready for next week.
It wasn't me, but i share the sentiment.

Evans is not the future.
Let him dominate at VFL level, but playing him at AFL shows gives us nothing both now and in the future. Play a kid in his place.

For a side like ours, that is supposedly not trying, we cannot ignore the sort of game he played in the VFL.

You want to set standards at the club?  Drop the talent, and reward the guys who are working.

Evans was second best of the blues on ground statistically (beaten by Ethan Phillips).
3 goals, 18 disposals, 8 marks, 8 tackles.
Thats putting your hand up.

Billy Wilson was next.  1 goal.  23 disposals.  8 marks 3 tackles.
Jordan Boyd not far behind Billy.
Will white also had a dip.

We weren't very good.  

I dont want to see Evans on our list next season, but if we are going to achieve anything for the rest of this year, you have to reward the solid VFL form when a player puts his hand up, particularly with the ones going as badly as they have been.

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #10 –
I missed the last quarter and a bit.
He wasn't really firing when I left,  but 11 disposals at 54% doesn't really scream promotion for Ben C ???

(Unless he's been told he's been playing against Melbourne and just have a run around and take it easy. We don't have a TOG% on AFL.com. He may have been managed.)

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #11 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Quote from: kruddler – on

It wasn't me, but i share the sentiment.

Evans is not the future.
Let him dominate at VFL level, but playing him at AFL shows gives us nothing both now and in the future. Play a kid in his place.

For a side like ours, that is supposedly not trying, we cannot ignore the sort of game he played in the VFL.

You want to set standards at the club?  Drop the talent, and reward the guys who are working.

Evans was second best of the blues on ground statistically (beaten by Ethan Phillips).
3 goals, 18 disposals, 8 marks, 8 tackles.
Thats putting your hand up.

Billy Wilson was next.  1 goal.  23 disposals.  8 marks 3 tackles.
Jordan Boyd not far behind Billy.
Will white also had a dip.

We weren't very good.  

I dont want to see Evans on our list next season, but if we are going to achieve anything for the rest of this year, you have to reward the solid VFL form when a player puts his hand up, particularly with the ones going as badly as they have been.

I'm not sure what you think we can acheive this year, other than playing kids and giving them experience.
 

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #12 –
Evans isnt a senior footballer and should never grace the senior team ever again, dont care if he kicked 50 goals in the VFL today, we need to be playing the kids who might amount to something not going back to the tried and failed.
Charleson might be worth a go as long as we dont do something stupid like start him on Kossie Pickett or Melksham in the back pocket and Id like to see more of Wilson and one Campo at least.

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #13 –
@kruddler

Now that the season is dead, you set standards.  You a kid wanting to play AFL footy?  You need to bang the door down like this VFL hack who isnt good enough.  Why is he so much better at the level than you if he's rubbish?

AFL players?  You want to play AFL footy or continue at the club?  Dont go to the VFL and give us what Blake Acres did today.  He should have been one of the best on.  Instead he was just going.  The workrate was there, the ability to hit targets not.  Thats a negative for an important senior player. 

Set the standards now.  Playing the kids at AFL level before they have time, or gifting us games through a rebuild is precisely why we are rubbish.  Brisbane's Deven Robertson has been squeezed out of their senior team.   He has that many players ahead of him, you could forgive him for going at half rat power.  They were 6 goals up with 10 minutes to play, and he ended up with a bloody nose because of his commitment to the contest, and statistically was 2nd best Lion on the day, out of 18 senior listed players.  He isnt guaranteed a game next week, and it shows.  Our boys by contrast, dont want it enough. Set THAT standard.  Its way more important than gifting any young kid a game.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: VFL 2025 Rd 16 Carlton vs Brisbane

Reply #14 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
@kruddler

Now that the season is dead, you set standards.  You a kid wanting to play AFL footy?  You need to bang the door down like this VFL hack who isnt good enough.  Why is he so much better at the level than you if he's rubbish?

AFL players?  You want to play AFL footy or continue at the club?  Dont go to the VFL and give us what Blake Acres did today.  He should have been one of the best on.  Instead he was just going.  The workrate was there, the ability to hit targets not.  Thats a negative for an important senior player. 

Set the standards now.  Playing the kids at AFL level before they have time, or gifting us games through a rebuild is precisely why we are rubbish.  Brisbane's Deven Robertson has been squeezed out of their senior team.   He has that many players ahead of him, you could forgive him for going at half rat power.  They were 6 goals up with 10 minutes to play, and he ended up with a bloody nose because of his commitment to the contest, and statistically was 2nd best Lion on the day, out of 18 senior listed players.  He isnt guaranteed a game next week, and it shows.  Our boys by contrast, dont want it enough. Set THAT standard.  Its way more important than gifting any young kid a game.

Look, i get it.

Set the standard, reward VFL form etc. Thats fine. That CAN lead to improvement on field. Its what we've done in the last few weeks though and how has that worked out?
If we only picked blokes who were setting standards, we'd have about half a teams worth of players running out each week.

So...that ain't working. Remembering we rewarded Evans 2 weeks ago, then found him wanting and shafted him back to the 2's, now we want to promote him again? Its not helping us, him or anyone.

We have to make some very tough calls this off-season. We've got 6-7 weeks to gather a wealth of information that we normally wouldn't be able to do if we were still in finals contention. Don't blow it.

Lemmey is possibly more likely to be delisted then re-signed for next year. Are we 100% certain thats the right thing to do?
Play him in the 1's and find out.
White? Young? Play them.
Evans and Fantasia....we know what we will get....what do we gain by playing them??

Billy Wilson....Jaxon Binns.....at this stage, i'd delist them both. Play them and see if they can surprise you.
Give Charleson a crack while you can.

These blokes will give you more effort in the 1's than most of the team so far. We are not playing to win. So what are we playing for??