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Topic: The rise.... and RISE of Marc Pittonet (Read 104297 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #390 –
We weren't smashed in the ruck when TDK was in the centre or around stoppages, as much as some might like to ignore that fact, it made a difference.

Cynics would claim we actually lost momentum when Pitto was rucking, but that would be unfair on Pitto because we were already riddle with injuries by that stage of the game. Prior to that we had ascendency and couldn't kick straight, the ruck wasn't our problem this week like it was in the Filth game.

Losing Hewett hurt us, as the game wore on our midfield became less and less effective.

The first step to winning is the break even, and build on it to improve from there.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #391 –
Quote from: LP – on
We weren't smashed in the ruck when TDK was in the centre or around stoppages, as much as some might like to ignore that fact, it made a difference.

Cynics would claim we actually lost momentum when Pitto was rucking, but that would be unfair on Pitto because we were already riddle with injuries by that stage of the game. Prior to that we had ascendency and couldn't kick straight, the ruck wasn't our problem this week like it was in the Filth game.

Losing Hewett hurt us, as the game wore on our midfield became less and less effective.

The first step to winning is the break even, and build on it to improve from there.

18 ruck contests.
5 hitouts
0 to advantage.

Yep, not even close to breaking even.

As i said, Jack the week before had...
16 ruck contests
3 hitouts
2 to advantage.

But he was terrible and cost us momentum and the game.
Whereas TDK kept us in it with his rucking ability?

I don't give a f*** if its Jack, or Harry, Or Young....or whoever.

But look at the output of these 'part time rucks' vs the output of a 'genuine 2nd ruck' and there is no difference....except in the opinion of the biased.

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #392 –
Yet it wasn't when TDK was in the ruck that we lost momentum, so how can that be with the HTA Genius aka Pitto in charge, doesn't HTA mean something?

Simply explained, HTA is a crock of shizen, possibly the worst most useless stat in the AFL and a total waste of time when measuring individual ruck effectiveness.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #393 –
Quote from: LP – on
Yet it wasn't when TDK was in the ruck that we lost momentum, so how can that be with the HTA Genius aka Pitto in charge, doesn't HTA mean something?

Simply explained, HTA is a crock of shizen, possibly the worst most useless stat in the AFL and a total waste of time when measuring individual ruck effectiveness.

Thats one theory.

The other is, you know nothing about what makes a good ruck. I know which way i'm leaning.
Your bias was showing when you were complaining how Pittonet was being well beaten in either this game or the last.
Stats showed he had more hitouts (and hitouts to advantage) compared to both opposing rucks at that point in time.

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #394 –
My criticism of the rubbish HTA stat is unrelated to whether I think Pitto played well or not, that is clearly demonstrated in my posts without ambiguity and as a fact that is not altered by your invented accusations.

You are the one telling Lods in another thread that HTA as defined by the official source is wrong, and telling me that as a stat it isn't dependant on the behaviour of targets the ruck tap hits even when the ruck can't see them, aka a blind tap. It's patently obvious a blind tap in the moment immediately after the tap is completely dependant on the behaviour of players other than just the ruck.

Anyone reading your posts can see you're desperate to paint Pitto as some super ruck that is a one stop solo ruck solution, I've speculated why you want that, and I've stated why I think it's rubbish logic and we need two effective rucks and not one and a spud as you seem to accept. To which you seem to respond by asserting / implying TDK is worse than SoJ, yet you allege that I am the one playing the man!

I notice you haven't gone so far as to assert we need no 2nd ruck at all, so I can only logically conclude you accept having our ar5e kicked for 5 minutes a quarter is acceptable.

Further, I and other readers can logically conclude from your extended claims that in the absence of Pitto you think SoJ must be the viable 1st ruck choice, ahead of TDK and others. That inference is the only way that your posts can be logically consistent. Because if SoJ is the best choice for 5 minutes then why not the rest?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #395 –
Fork me dead you guys have argued for so long it's not even clear what your contention is anymore.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #396 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Fork me dead you guys have argued for so long it's not even clear what your contention is anymore.
Pittonet - good, elite even
TDK - bad
Jack - average

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #397 –
Quote from: kruddler – on
Pittonet - good, elite even
TDK - bad
Jack - average

Cool.  I disagree because form is important, and context.

You need to take a horses for courses approach with this than a pecking order that is arguably flawed. 

Without pittonet not one person on this forum would go with Jack as our first ruck as an example.  TDK is the one.  So then the choice between these two becomes more about what else they offer.  For mine, tdk is a way better get out of jail marking target than Jack.  Jack is a better midfield contributor of the two.  This is where the team balance comes into he equation.

Beyond that the use of statistics and this team and its performance this season is beyond useless.  We have played a stat boosting style all season. I think its an arrest momentum strategy that we need to learn in order to try stop run ons but it's making life difficult for everyone.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #398 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Without pittonet not one person on this forum would go with Jack as our first ruck as an example.  TDK is the one.

First ruck argument is a different argument and i agree TDK takes it by default.
This argument stemmed from team balance though.

This is largely about the benefit of both as a 2nd ruck option.
TDK 'offers' more, but actually delivers less.
SOJ is a ludicrous choice by comparison, but actually outperforms TDK by comparison....and gives the added benefit of greater team balance.

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #399 –
2022/2023

TDK alone: 8 wins 6 losses and a draw
Pittonet alone: 2 wins 6 losses
TDK and Pitt: 6 wins and 4* losses

*One of those losses Pittonet was injured in the first quarter.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #400 –
Quote from: madbluboy – on
2022/2023

TDK alone: 8 wins 6 losses and a draw
Pittonet alone: 2 wins 6 losses
TDK and Pitt: 6 wins and 4* losses

*One of those losses Pittonet was injured in the first quarter.

Oh, well since its the 4th time you've posted, it must make it right now.

The other 3 responses are null and void now.  ::)

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #401 –
I updated it.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #403 –
We seem to have gone quiet on the ruck stuff, I thought for sure there would be discussion on last Friday's figures! :o



Really, I'm not sure what to make of it.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"
 

Re: The Ruck Division .... Is It Really Competent Enough ??

Reply #404 –
Quote from: LP – on
We seem to have gone quiet on the ruck stuff, I thought for sure there would be discussion on last Friday's figures! :o



Really, I'm not sure what to make of it.

Clearly didn't read the post game thread