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Topic: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments  (Read 380945 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #750 –
So if seems a pretty safe bet that Jess Wilson will be the new premier.   It may be a bit of a poison chalice.

The really interesting watch will be how long before the 'old men in blue suits' try to wrest back control of their party......
This is now the longest premiership drought in the history of the Carlton Football Club - more evidence of climate change?

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #751 –
Quote from: tonyo – on
So if seems a pretty safe bet that Jess Wilson will be the new premier.  It may be a bit of a poison chalice.

The really interesting watch will be how long before the 'old men in blue suits' try to wrest back control of their party......
The hardcore rusted on Libs she would have needed to battle in the olden days are dying off pretty quickly, they were Jack Elliott's generation who grew out of the post war years.

Also what has recently been diminished is the fundamentalist Christian component, they have moved out of Liberal further right towards more Libertarian alignments and closer to PHON.

 Much the same is also happening on the other side of politics, which is why I suppose so many now view either side as the same, they all seem to be approaching the median.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #752 –
The closer it gets, the worse Jess appears.  Likely to pull the 'I didn't know the true financial position' card in order to not fulfil any promise of spending/cost relief.  My sister describes her as if you're being told off by the seasoned school teacher.

Jess is part of the 'old men in blue suits' - her dad, being part of a liberal think tank etc.

ON won't release any costings - probably ran out of toes and fingers to count.  Motherhood statements are easy.  Tricky bit is the detail of how it's going to happen.

Labor - well, are they even in the conversation?

Of the three, how many are promises for things that are already in the pipeworks, how many are copies/variants of each other, and how many are genuinely theirs.  What are the differentiations that will make the change - probably we don't want labor is it.

As a side note (and not sure if this is right) - teachers got their payrise. It seems budgets for staffing haven't increased, so class sizes are going to balloon as schools can't afford the same staffing levels and support/specialist programs will be cut.  Not a peep from the politicians.

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #753 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Quote from: DJC – on


Public hearings started in the same month as the election and will erode any support that the ALP may still have.  The report should be handed down well into the first year of the new government who will be able to use it to their advantage.  Damage control would have been calling the commission far earlier and retaining management of the report.

I’d say that it’s more like self-inflicted, terminal damage.



Sorry DJC, I respectfully disagree. 

This was part of the Jacinta Allen knifing and Ben Carroll handover to attempt to save face leading up to the election race.  Just like the pothole fixing that they are doing.

The spectre of it, was hanging over the Labor government.

Strategically they knew she would lose, and offed her to bring in Ben Carroll.  Would the Royal Commission have occurred had that not happened?  Its a way to attempt to distance Ben Carroll from Jacinta Allen, and save face, and blame the outgoing leader for all the woes.

Nothing more, nothing less.

I cannot fault the strategy, but to think this is noble thinking or "falling on ones sword" is naive, and Ben is actively spruiking it on advertisements as him trying to fix things. 

Even if they had a point, the labor government at state level has ruled the roost for a very long time.  You would be better off mounting an argument that Federal government is more culpable as the Libs have dictated that component for longer.

There's no doubt that Carroll called the Royal Commission in an attempt to distance himself from Allan and Andrews, but the timing couldn't have been worse for the ALP.  We're in the final fortnight of the election campaign and every day there's going to be headlines from the Commission driving another nail in the coffin just like yesterday's scolding from the senior counsel over the redacted diary.  Jess Wilson should be instructing her candidates to keep their mouths shut and let the Commission do their work for them.

I suppose that Carroll really had no option but the unwritten rules of Royal Commissions are never call one if you don't know the outcomes and can't control the timing of the report.  Allan should really have called it when she took over, but it would probably still be just moving deck chairs on the Titanic.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #754 –
Quote from: DJC – on
Quote from: shawny – on


Seeing you dodged my point i will do the same on that long winded spin reply about nothing.

Have you noticed the Big build royal commission going on?

Or do you refuse to acknowledge it because its the labour government being accused of corruption? 

Pretend the same inquiry was with Trump instead....  Would be 50 pages written on it if the names were swapped.

 

Cheques and balances    :-[

You really need to think before you post nonsense Shawny ... and you need to stop trying to deflect with continual references to Taco in this thread and continual references to Australian governments in the Taco thread.  They're completely separate issues ... and threads. 

It is the Royal Commission into the Integrity of Major Public and Civil Infrastructure Construction Projects in Victoria.  It was called by the State Labor Government "to inquire into and report on matters relating to corruption, criminal conduct and serious misconduct on or in relation to major construction projects in Victoria."  The allegations that prompted the Royal Commission concerned corruption and criminal conduct by the CFMEU and construction companies and poor oversight by government agencies and, potentially, the Government.  The Commission is in the first week of its first block of public hearings and, to be perfectly honest, it hasn't even begun to warm up.

Your spinning responses actually remind me of Andrews with his covid responses when pressed. Avoid any part that may show you up and go off on a tangent raising different points to move the narrative. 

I will try one more time: Why is a royal commission needed if our polices (cheques and balances) are set up to prevent corruption.

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #755 –
The lawyers and senior public servants with provided the RC with redacted evidence should be given 24 hours to produce the documents or face contempt.

The Andrews-Allan-Carroll cover ups keep coming.

Corrupt to the core this mob.

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #756 –
I gather the redacted evidence probably means legal contracts, it's likely all sides of this case will do the same when commecial confidentiality and non-disclosure applies, but only the government side will be labeled a cover up.

I believe the commission can go into camera and have those issues address, but then the same critics would claim a cover up by the commission.

In many cases it's not just an arbitrary decision to redact but a legal requirement, but the media never report it that way.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #757 –
I'm with Shawny on the redacted documents....produce the primary document or face contempt.  I see no legitimate reason to produce redacted material- "commercial in confidence" is a weak excuse in a RC in which such documents are probably central to the entire affair. Redacted text is not transparency and it reeks of guilt.
DrE is no more... you ok with that harmonica man?

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #758 –
Quote from: shawny – on
Quote from: DJC – on


You really need to think before you post nonsense Shawny ... and you need to stop trying to deflect with continual references to Taco in this thread and continual references to Australian governments in the Taco thread.  They're completely separate issues ... and threads. 

It is the Royal Commission into the Integrity of Major Public and Civil Infrastructure Construction Projects in Victoria.  It was called by the State Labor Government "to inquire into and report on matters relating to corruption, criminal conduct and serious misconduct on or in relation to major construction projects in Victoria."  The allegations that prompted the Royal Commission concerned corruption and criminal conduct by the CFMEU and construction companies and poor oversight by government agencies and, potentially, the Government.  The Commission is in the first week of its first block of public hearings and, to be perfectly honest, it hasn't even begun to warm up.

Your spinning responses actually remind me of Andrews with his covid responses when pressed. Avoid any part that may show you up and go off on a tangent raising different points to move the narrative. 

I will try one more time: Why is a royal commission needed if our polices (cheques and balances) are set up to prevent corruption.

I think you mean checks and balances - cheques are last century now.

A Royal Commission is the ultimate in checks and balances.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #759 –
The unredacted diary was provided to the Commission as soon as it was requested, with an apology for originally providing the redacted copy.

I’m not sure what the public servant was thinking, but apparently even the unredacted version of his diary doesn’t make a lot of sense.

The journalists covering the Commission get to see the documents to be tabled and are told who will be called on the following day but are under an embargo and can’t reveal any information until the documents are tabled and/or witnesses are called.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #760 –
Quote from: DJC – on
I’m not sure what the public servant was thinking, but apparently even the unredacted version of his diary doesn’t make a lot of sense.
The problem with a diary is that there are no demand on syntax or language, it can be as cryptic, vague or specific as the notetaker likes but it doesn't need to be consistent.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #761 –
Quote from: LP – on
Quote from: DJC – on
I’m not sure what the public servant was thinking, but apparently even the unredacted version of his diary doesn’t make a lot of sense.
The problem with a diary is that there are no demand on syntax or language, it can be as cryptic, vague or specific as the notetaker likes but it doesn't need to be consistent.

Yes, when I was a public servant we were told that our diaries weren’t subject to Freedom of Information because they could be in the owner’s version of shorthand and couldn’t be reliably interpreted by someone else.  However, FoI is not a Royal Commission and the diarist can be compelled to explain their diary entries.
"Negative waves are not helpful. Try saying something righteous and hopeful instead." Oddball
 

Re: Shawny’s concerns about Victorian and Australian Governments

Reply #762 –
Quote from: DJC – on
However, FoI is not a Royal Commission and the diarist can be compelled to explain their diary entries.
And they can explain the contents however they like, you just can't infer meaning outside of a direct interpretation by the author!

In the R&D sector, be it somewhere like CSIRO or commercial, it's very common for researchers to use their own task specific shorthand that is designed to avoid reproduction if the diary is lost or stolen. It's considered a safeguard, and they do it for both communications and math. Equations can look completely wrong or unintelligible.

I tried this myself once, but I could never remember what I was going to write.

PS; I have a mate who is a globally renowned engineer, he has dyslexia and documents everything in minute detail. You can't read a line of it because he's invented his own written language.

I suffer from something I've labelled Scribolepsy, give me a pen and paper and it's like sedative!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"