Anyone catch Daniel Hoyne on SEN? Talking about teams one at a time, started with Carlton and he said that our ball movement versus Port Adelaide was the fourth fastest this year by any team. Carlton went from long, down the line, tram track football pre the bye to change of angles, speed on ball after it. It was plain for all to see that the players didn’t have the skills to execute. So the coaches tried changing things, the players couldn't execute. Suggested we may well go back to old faithful v Coll.
There was a 'ladder' of fastest ball movement for the year. I think it was before the Port game. We were 5th or 6th on the list for the year.
Must admit that poster did nail it the last time he said it. Doesn't mean he will this time thought. might have be a coincidence last time.
Anyway, the lack of any hunger at training is more an issue.
Play the kids who will be hungry, result doesnt matter, lets find some players for 2026 and beyond. Voss might enjoy the last 8 weeks if we give him some players who want to learn and give effort for 4 quarters, he owes Binns a game too after singling him out.
I know i'm not the only one, but i've been calling for Lemmey for weeks now for the above reason and to spare the injured players we currently have. Not many who haven't been given a crack yet, but he is one.
We have played 39 players this year.
Only players not to play.... Newman - out for year Smith - out for year Monaghan - irish rookie Duffy - irish rookie Ben Camporeale - should play this week Lemmey - should play this week Charleson - showed something in the VFL this week
For the record, only the bombers have used more players than us, 1 more, with 40. 1 other team has used 37 a few other teams have used 36.
The rest of the 8, 12th, 14th and last have used 34 players.....everyone else is more.
Shows a very distinct correlation of injuries/players used and ladder position. Hard for us to make it near the pointy end when year on year, we have to use more players than just about everyone else.
Do you really think our MC put blokes out there who aren't trying, the MC's job depends on them.
Do you really think our MC put blokes out there who are not 100% fit, the MC's job depends on them. ....and thats why some will be looking for a new job.
Unfit players play all the time, everyone knows it. The MC will always say they are 100% fit though. Its BS. So 'trying' can be limited by how fit they are and how much they can get from 'trying'.
Sometimes the trying the players are doing is trying not to throw up because they are so sick and under the weather. Looking at Patrick "Mr Quarantine" Cripps as our most recent example.
Im just surprised a guy coming off an ankle reconstruction, and then surgery to remove hardware in his knee is somehow in tip top shape (to go with a team that is playing poor footy).
If gunston was an also ran id say fair enough but he's anything but an also ran.
Meanwhile when Charlie dines out on these types its the only reason he's won a coleman, but when he doesn't all of a sudden its a lack of want.
Maybe I'm more forgiving than most but when you've got a bloke who's generally been good value for 70% of his career when he goes through a flat patch im not really that keen to string him out to dry.
You forgot the part where that same player hobbled off the ground with a lower leg injury in the past month
You keep bringing up how we've been poor for 30+ years.
Yet now the other sacked coaches don't matter.
Either you bring history into it or you don't. Can't have it both ways.
"Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it."
Historically we have been crap for 3 decades and thats a fact - what is debatable is whether sacking coaches was a reason behind those results. i dont think it was but more so who we selected as to the pivotal failure was imo.
I said from day one i wasnt a fan of Voss and he was the wrong choice out of the candidates available and thats where the mistake was made not what the previous failed coaches did or didnt do nor our history in failed coaches.
Time to rip the bandaid off and hopefully this time we find the right man for the job.
What was 'so wrong' about Voss?
1. He wasn't a rookie coach. He'd had a go, then served a long apprenticeship after that to gain some more experience. 2. He is not too old. Plenty of experience, but not an old coot too out of touch with the modern players/game 3. He has had success as a player, a team and sustained success at that....and all from being a nothing team beforehand. 4. He is well respected, the game over and doesn't have any public 'woopsies' like other candidates. 5. He has a carlton connection, previously barracking for us and wanted the job before as well - when Ratten got it. This keeps the natives at bay. 6. He is a good media performer and doesn't embarrass himself or the club, quite the opposite. He invites others in.
As best as i can tell, the only 'negatives' is that he hasn't won us anything yet and may not be a tactical genius on matchday......and along with his mates, don't know how to pick a side.
I'm not sure there are many other coaches out there that tick as many boxes as him.
Ben Camporeale - 22 touches, 10 tackles, 7 inside 50's, 5 score involvements, 4 clearances and 1.1 - That deserves a callup. Moir - 17 touches, 3 tackles, 4 score involvements, 4 clearances and 4.1 - Give him a go this week too Lemmey - 3 goals from not much, get him in and rest Charlie....can't do any worse.
Pittonet - 41 hitouts, 17 touches, 4 clearances, 4 tackles, 5 score involvements - Good enough to get a game at just about every other club at the moment.
so you're saying the guys who are correct in sacking coaches cant hire the right one or keep choosing the wrong one?
Maybe the blokes making those decisions should get sacked instead.
Just because we have sacked a lot of coaches doesnt have any bearing imo on the current situation. Every decision has to be on merit and Voss is not the man and never was.
An amazing footballer doesnt make a good coach.
We have no system still cant deliver the ball into F50 have no plan B.
Our list is lacking pieces on all lines but from a strategic perspective our coaching group led by Voss is below par and not anywhere near what the better teams have. We need a coach as well as a coaching group that will get the very best out of every player and provide systems when we get injuries the whole list knows the system and knows they role to play. We lose a few players and become a rabble.
4 years is enough time.
You keep bringing up how we've been poor for 30+ years.
Yet now the other sacked coaches don't matter.
Either you bring history into it or you don't. Can't have it both ways.
"Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it."
For me I think Jack would be super. What about a joint Jack and Cerra?
Offer TDK VC.
Maybe Weiters, he’s a great speaker but I can’t help but wonder if he’s looking much more into the future into a career at the top of the AFL. He seems extremely intelligent to me.
Jack ticks a lot of the boxes. The one concern I have is his durability Injuries have played a fair part in his career and he's struggled to get a full season in
I can't think of a single reason as to how we win this game other than one....overconfidence on their part. But it is Collingwood so the chances of that are slim.
The very least we can do though is make them earn it. Hit them hard and make them fight for every possession and every goal. Get up in their faces and pressure them for four quarters....... And then I woke up
Even when we were winning wooden spoons, we were still winning the odd game we had no right too.
This could be one....most likely isn't, but 'could 'be.
Ollie hollands is showing signs he could make a good leader.
When the question was posed, i did a bit of a mental run down the list (knowing i looked at the age profile just yesterday for you) and i went past all the 25 and over players for 1 reason or another and ended up stopping at Ollie Hollands.
Not sure how soon he (or anyone) may be called upon to step up into that captains role, but if you want a bloke that busts his gut and stands up for teammates unconditionally, you'd struggle to find someone better than Ollie.
@kruddler continuing on that average age chat, was just doing some various mental gymnastics about sides and average ages.
It could be right, but I think its being over stated somewhat.
Off thr top of my head our oldest players today would have been cripps, docherty, Williams, saad, haynes, McGovern. Acres probably a smidgeon behind them. The rest are all under that age or thereabouts.
So it may very well be thr oldest average, but we dont exactly have a cliff coming where the rest of the side is in dire straights.
@Thryleon A better breakdown of current ages 30+: 6 - Cripps, McGovern, Williams, Saad, Docherty, Haynes Missing 1 - Newman 27-29: 7 - Silvagni, Weitering, Curnow, Cincotta, Hewett, Acres, Fantasia - Missing 2 - Pittonet, McKay 25-26: 5 - Boyd, L. Young, Fogarty, Cerra, De Koning Missing 2 - Cottrell, Walsh*** turns 25 next week
Thats 18 players.... From the rest who played....
23: 1 - FYoung. 21: 2 - Motlop, O. Hollands 20: 2 - Lord, Wilson
Don't know what considers a 'cliff', but you'd expect better from that group if they were fit.
Biggest issue with that list is the younger age brackets. eg 25-26 has 5 players. TDK will walk. L. Young and Boyd are not considered best 22, Fogarty might be, but only just. Cerra only managed 17 touches last night and thats not good enough.
Although not all his fault, this does not bode well: FACT: Michael Voss has coached 194 games for 88 wins, 104 losses, and two draws. His 45.88% win percentage is the second-worst among active coaches who have coached at least 40 games. I didn't actually realise his he's record was that bad.
He had a win % of 39% at Brisbane. He has a win % of 53% at Carton.
I don't want to point out the obvious, but he wins more than he loses with us.
